TCO 222 | Live Your Best Life

223: Three New Peloton Tread Instructors plus our interview with Natalie Oven

TCO 222 | Live Your Best Life


Analysts are talking down Peloton stock.

John Mills joins us to discuss the future of Peloton wearables.

Dr. Jenn – Adjusting workouts during perimenopause.

We have new instructors – Daniel McKenna, Kristen Ferguson & Marcel Dinkins

Peloton surprised people with visits from their favorite instructors.

Christine D’Ercole is trying on wedding dresses.

Kendall pens a touching tribute to a fallen soldier/fan she never met.

Chelsea Jackson Roberts shares stretching yoga poses with In Style.

PopSugar has a core workout playlist from Emma Lovewell.

Jess Sims, Ally Love, & Cody Rigsby get a quick mention in New York Post.

Tunde pops up in Marie Claire.

Angelo joins us to discuss carb-loading for a triathlon with dietary restrictions.

No live classes in England 9/4-9/13. Is the new studio almost ready?

Shape Magazine writes about Peloton’s anti-racism initiative.

There are now subtitles during live classes.

Peloton gets subpoenaed by the DOJ.

We finally know who was behind the Washington Post Peloton account.

All this plus our interview with Natalie Oven.

Watch the episode here:

Listen to the podcast here

Three New Peloton Tread Instructors plus our interview with Natalie Oven

We should start by saying thanks to everybody that dropped by our Zoom call.

That was a lot of fun. We had some fun Peloton conversations, some fun non-Peloton conversations. We get deep and it was great. I love those convos.

Those are always fun. It’s nice to hang.

The audience turned into our little focus group. We had an impromptu focus group conversation, which was super fascinating. Anybody in our actual Clip Out group will be hearing more about that soon. It was super cool. If you guys ever get a chance and we’re having one, make sure you drop by because they are tons of fun.

That’s another reason to join the group. That’s where we tend to post that stuff. We get you little special links, but I don’t want to get ahead of myself and shamelessly plug before you tell people what’s coming up on the show.

We’ve got stock issues to discuss and we’ll do that with John Mills. We have Dr. Jenn drop by and she’s going to discuss perimenopause. For all of you guys who don’t care about perimenopause, you just fast forward through that. All you women who do, you might want to listen up.

For some of the men, you still might want to listen in case you have a woman in your life who is staring down the barrel of that.

Specifically, it’s about workouts during perimenopause. We don’t get deeper into the discussion that you’re not going to want to hear. We also have MetPro dropping by and we talk all about carb-loading for a triathlon when you have a special diet that you need to take into consideration. We’re also going to talk about tons of different rumors that are swirling around Peloton, and the instructors in the news galore. We’re going to touch on all of the Peloton things.

Before we get to all that, shameless plugs. Don’t forget, we’re available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, iHeart, Tune-In. Wherever you find your podcast, you can find us. While you’re there, be sure and follow us so you never miss an episode. Also, if you want to leave us a review, that’s always helpful. We have a new review. This is from Felicia JA and it says, “I love Fridays and a new Clip Out episode on my morning Friday commute, and it sets the tone for my day. This is the only podcast I come back to week after week. Keep being awesome.” The leaderboard name is Balanced Fee RN.

Thank you so much. What a nice review.

We also have our Facebook page, While you’re there, like the page and join the group where you will get things like a link to our Zoom calls if you want to hang out with us on a Saturday night sometimes. You can sign up for our newsletter where every week, we send the links to articles, pictures, and things of that nature, all in one easily digestible format in case you couldn’t find them on our page or out in the wild. You can do that at If you want to watch these episodes, they all live over at our YouTube channel, They are all there for you to watch. You can watch them on your big screen if you’re that much of a masochist.

Finally, if you want something to do that’s really easy to help the show, just share it on social media. If you love Peloton or you probably have people in your life who love Peloton, they might like to know about us. Click share whether it’s Facebook or Instagram or what have you. Let them know that we’re out there. We would greatly appreciate it. That’s all of that. Let’s dig in, shall we?

We shall.

Joining us is John Mills from Run, Lift and Live. John, how is it going?

How’s it going?

Let’s start with all the stock stuff and how analysts are starting to take a dump on Peloton stock.

You know what’s coming. This was written for them to sell a story. We talked about that before. The Motley Fool is good with finding those narratives.

The Motley Fool is like one of those fake psychics that keep saying things until you nod, then they’re like, “I knew it.”

It is right there in the title, The Motley Fool. They’re like, “You’re a fool if you follow us.” I feel like they’re telling you that.

I never paid attention to them until we started doing this. I feel like there are always two articles on Peloton. There’s a good one and a bad one, then in five years they can go, “See how right we were?”

It’s frustrating because they are saying that there are many reasons to avoid Peloton stock. For people who haven’t seen this article, that’s the gist. They’re saying, “Because they had a bad earnings call and because of the pandemic,” and then accounting problems? It’s not an accounting problem. There was a treadmill recall. What is this accounting problem? They make it sound like somebody is in trouble for embezzlement or something. Why are they even using that phrase? What is that about?

On the earnings call, Jill Woodworth referenced an accounting error, which they weren’t going to go back and change any previously reported earnings, but she referenced it. That reference is what they’re talking about. They explode that out like, “Big company that knows what they’re doing would then have this issue.” They’re exploding that into something much larger than it is. It was to be expected. I wasn’t surprised at all. They then went back in time. They pulled a Back To The Future on us. They went back to, “The pandemic is going to be ended in a second, and then what?” We’ve been hearing that for how long.

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We have, at least eight months. The pandemic is still with us, folks, in case you haven’t been paying attention.

It’s not like Peloton did a marketing campaign where they’re like, “You can return your bike when the pandemic is over.” They are still going to have the bike and they’re still going to have the monthly subscription. Maybe they won’t sell as many.

The pandemic fast-forwarded their growth. It doesn’t change anything about the base that is Peloton.

We’re in the slow season. The busy season will start in October. It’s a perfect time to go see the numbers. It sounds like this article was probably written in September of 2020.

In October, they’re going to be like, “Oh my God, Peloton is doing so well. You guys should totally buy this stock. They’ve overcome all of their obstacles this year. They’re amazing.” Two days later, “No, they’re not.”

On the heels of that, Yahoo had an article about an analyst slashing their target price in Peloton to $45 a share.

We have to talk about this because it’s ridiculous like $45 a share. Come on.

You want a little extreme.

Somebody just wanted to see their name on Yahoo News.

A brutal quarter? They are still making billions of dollars. Do you know how therapists will say it’s a catastrophic language? These analysts are the queens of catastrophic language, “A brutal quarter.” I don’t know about you guys, but Peloton is still doing better than most other businesses out there. This is a bit extreme.

The headline is of course the clickbait, but listening to the reasoning behind it. That’s where I feel like it’s so black and white. They’re not more broadly considering things. In my mind, it’s going back to the “Is it offensive or defensive” stance. They’re back into that in this as well. They are heavy on this is defensive, there are competitors, and they got to do something.

Maybe these people work for Echelon or something.

They’re having with this movement of selling the bike for a lower price. A big percentage of their revenue came from bike sales. That’s going to be a problem. It’s like they’re not even thinking about the fact that ultimately, you’re trying to get that subscription revenue. I don’t know if that’s a bad thing that you’re changing that ratio. We’ve got other products coming. That’s the unknown. That’s the piece that we don’t know, but I’m sure Peloton is well aware of their expectations around who and how many units they’re expecting to sell off whatever is coming. There’s a piece there that’s missing in all of these articles.

If I remember correctly from reading this, which granted it irritated me so I moved through it pretty quickly. It was something to the effect of like, “I’m saying $45 a month because their subscription fee is $40 and they cut the bike price down by $400. There were all these runways that were way too soon. They shouldn’t have done that, so we’re going to value it at slightly above their revenue for how much they make in a given month off of one person.” I don’t understand what that has to do with anything. They’re going to continue to have that revenue coming in at $40 a month. Who knows if it might go up whenever they add some of these other products in? It felt very short-sighted like, “I just want to have attention. Let me have a big reaction so people pay attention to me.”

That’s my piece of it. I see these analysts or I assume they’re supposed to be predictive of the market with a forward-looking perspective. It’s clear that this generates clicks because that’s not forward-looking. The statements they’re making don’t consider some of the things that are coming down the pipe. The fact that we’re about to go into the holiday season, what’s going on in the news? It doesn’t seem like they’re adding that to the equation. I know it’s coming.

I know that there are other analysts out there that don’t agree with what’s happening, and there are positive articles out there. I mentioned these because they were both pretty inflammatory. Unfortunately, they’re out there. People who don’t know much about the stock market are looking at those and making decisions about whether or not they want to invest in Peloton. I hope they read some other articles because to get a well-balanced idea of what’s actually happening, those are the worst that you can read.

I probably look crazy in my group because I’m like, “Look at this. What do you guys think of this?” All the time I’m going, “This is nuts.” People are like, “John, you’re crazy. I wasn’t agreeing with it.”

“I’m just a messenger.”

It leads to a great conversation so keep doing what you’re doing.

You also find an interesting article about wearable fitness trackers and the explosive growth that they are anticipating in that space.

There’s a fitness research outlet that ran a report on the expectations around wearable fitness trackers, and their growth over the next six years. They’re expecting it to triple. Based on their research, leading in that category are running and cycling. Reading it and looking at the graphics that they were presenting, it came to my mind, if that’s generally the categories where someone would wear a wearable, and it seems like we’ve got some insight around Peloton potentially releasing some type of wearable, wouldn’t it make the most sense to drop that wearable when you’re producing more running content?

I got your point. If everything had gone the way that we planned without the pandemic, and I say we like the whole world, if you back up, the tread would have gone on sale in America back in May. That didn’t happen, but if it had, the wearable wouldn’t have been ready to put out in the market yet. Now here we are knowing that the Tiger device is coming out in the fall. It ends up being a lot closer to the tread, but that wasn’t the original plan. You have to go back and look at what the original plan was. Also. I have no idea what this is going to be priced at, but I’m picturing this Tiger device is being an add-on, less expensive thing.

It’s going to be easier to bundle it with a wearable at that point. Also, I know there’s a lot of speculation around what this wearable is going to do, but I think that it’s going to be more of a bare-bones thing. This is just my own opinion. This is going to be for the people who don’t have an Apple watch. This is going to be for the people who don’t have a Garmin. Maybe they don’t even have a Fitbit. This is something they want to track in all of their sports. They want to be able to put it on when they’re working out. Maybe they wear it during the day. Maybe they don’t, but it’s specifically for working out, then it went to work across all modalities. This wearable is going to be for that person. Because of that, it does make sense to put it out with the Tiger because then now you have these other things you’re going to be able to do that you’re being pulled into. This might be a good time to add to your fitness.

That makes sense. If that’s the case, it probably doesn’t have to tie so well. I hope that they have a broader vision for this because if you’re looking at this report, if it has any credibility or credence, I don’t know. If it does and if this market is truly going to triple in the next 5 to 6 years, if they put out a product that competes in this space, then they can get a slice of that. I hope they are, even if it starts the way you’re describing.

You hope there’s a long-term plan.

There’s going to be a market for that. The people who have their Apple watch are probably not. It’s all one ecosystem there and they’re good, but I could see people with Fitbits or Garmins making the jump.

Even you, Tom, not that you do Peloton, but I could see you being the person that would buy this thing that I’m envisioning. You don’t want to wear a watch all the time but you would like to track what your heart rate is and to be able to see it. If you were doing Peloton, I could see you being like, “You got me. I’ll wear the thing when I’m working out and not the rest of the time.”

Especially if it’s less expensive. Maybe they’ll come out with two tiers.

If they’re going to continue to do their better best, that certainly makes sense. John, there is a place for what you’re saying. As a consumer and as a future investor, I’m like, “You better not piss off Apple too much.” You need to tread carefully because Peloton can’t do everything the best. I love Peloton. Everyone knows how much I love Peloton but they cannot be the king of every single area. It doesn’t work that way. I want them to take a step in and I want them to take just a step. I don’t want them to dive all the way in.

That would align historically with how they’ve moved in this space. It makes sense, everything you’re saying. When I posted this, I hadn’t had pre-thought. I was thinking it out as I was writing it. I was answering my questions, then answering the next question based on an assumed answer to the first question. It was crazy. First I was like, “If running is big and they got a tread, why don’t they drop this?”

It’s a good question to ask because you do have to go back in time and look at everything. We have the benefit of doing this show every week. We sit down and we talk through this, but there are a lot of people that ask these questions that don’t look at it from that perspective. They’re looking at it like, “I’m picking up a Peloton thought process today.” They only think about today. It’s good that you’re asking these questions and that we talk through them. Somebody else asked me a question and I feel like it’s along those same lines. You need to look at the long-term effect of Peloton to get why he was asking.

He was asking me, “Do you think that they are going to take the bike trade-in program and also apply it to Europe?” I don’t think that they will because people in America have had their bikes some as far back as 2014. That’s the trade-in program. That’s who we’re talking to. You guys got yours a year and a half ago so settle down. Not that he was snotty about it at all, but I’m just joking. In all seriousness, it would not make sense for Peloton in my mind to offer that. From the Europe standpoint, without thinking that through, if you’re a person in Europe that bought your bike, you are like, “Why aren’t we getting that program?” You haven’t thought through the past of Peloton because you don’t do this show every week so why would you. We’re big nerds here.

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As it relates to the tracker thing, I was just spinning. I then get to the second question and then I’m like, “We already got the insight that these strengths or computer-based products and the tracker will likely drop around a common time.” I’m talking through this running thing, but does this mean all of them are about to drop in about ten minutes? I then come to that place. I started thinking Beachbody is about to drop this MYX bike with the BODi interactive on September 21st. I then dropped to a whole another topic. I’m like, “Is this defensive?” I posed these questions all in that order.

I don’t think the creation of the product is defensive but perhaps the timing of the announcement is. It’s like, “You’re going to announce that? We’ll drop our thing on top of you. Now, who’s going to talk about you?”

It might actually be offensive. That came to mind at the end of it. I came to this conclusion in answering all my prior questions while writing it that the stuff was about to drop in ten minutes. If it does, what does that mean for BODi interactive? That’s what I came to. I took it way too far.

I don’t think so. Them using their muscle to suck up all the oxygen in the market from a promotional standpoint is not a bad play.

Didn’t they do that whenever Apple did their big Apple Fitness+ release? Wasn’t it on the same day or the day before?

They were close together. I’m not sure who stepped on who, but it was definitely in quick succession.

They then hosted that quick call on the same day.

They were trying to pull attention away. John, regardless of whether or not you’re right about any of this or anything else, you’re starting to think like these analysts.

That right there tare fighting words.

“Peloton will be at $2 a share.”

I think that the analyst will be saying that it’s a defensive move, not offensive. They will be very suspicious whenever Peloton drops their wearable, even though we’ve been talking about it for months because they don’t pay attention to this show. I think that you’re giving them ideas.

You’re right. If they drop this any time in the vicinity of September 21st, we’re going to hear all of them. There are going to be all these analysts talking about this defensive stuff. Maybe I am thinking like an analyst now. This ain’t good. I need to go drink some sweet tea.

You should go right for Yahoo Finance or something like that and make some cash off of it.

I should be a ghostwriter for Motley Fool.

Assuming you’re still here next episode and not working for Yahoo Finance, where can people find you?

They can find me on Facebook, in my Run, Lift & Live group or page. They can find me on Instagram @RunLiftAndLive or at

Thank you.

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Joining us once again is Dr. Jenn Mann, licensed marriage, family and child therapist, and sports psychology consultant. She was also a five-year national team member in rhythmic gymnastics. She also has an app called No More Diets that you should check out. Ladies and gentlemen, it’s Dr. Jenn.


I have another fun question for you from our community. I don’t know what you’ll think of this one. This is from Erica Dunn Meyer. “The perimenopause is real and it’s as awful as it sounds.” I agree with her, “As we get older, men and women, our metabolism and hormones take on minds of their own. How can we adjust our workouts to help with the biological chaos that is happening? Mood swings, stubborn belly fat, weight gain, and other fun physical side effects to name a few. It’s like being a moody teenager all over again, minus the acne.” I still have acne.

Did she say in this how often she’s working out or anything that she’s doing right now?

No, but I know she does workout a lot because she’s a regular.

I would definitely say you want to always check with your doctor and see what they recommend. You also want to look at what helps your mood the most. It sounds like the weight and the mood were the two things that jumped out at you the most that are impacting you. What you want to do is look at what are the workouts that give you the most joy? What are the ones that change your mood the most? At my house, one of my daughters was in a bad mood and she’s not super into Peloton. She’s very athletic. I was like, “I’m about to work out. Why don’t you come work with me?” She did three classes and she was like, “That totally changed my rhythm.” It was so much fun to work out with her.

It’s looking at what are the workouts that change your mood the most? What gives you the most endorphins? What gives you the best mood change? Who are the instructors you connect to? That can be those people who you look at when you’re feeling moody or feeling down. They have a whole series of mood runs, walks, and classes that are happy classes, confident classes, sad classes that can help you get in touch with what you’re in the mood for. Kendall has some great mental health rides that are terrific and very inspiring. Also, look at who lifts you up. For me, since Robin has been back from maternity leave, I’ve been very into Robin because she’s so inspiring and she’s so cool. I love that she’s come back so beautifully from being out for maternity leave. I find that inspiring. That’s a key thing.

You want to talk to your doctor about weight-bearing exercises, bones, and all that sort of stuff. I also do think that there is a level of acceptance that we have to have about our changing bodies. As long as we are doing healthy things, we are working out, we’re feeding our body the food that it needs, and also allowing ourselves to have some fun foods that allow us to relax and enjoy food and not be “perfect eaters,” which is not good for our psyche necessarily. We also have to accept that our bodies are going to change.

That needs to be okay to some degree that we need to work on embracing that this body has gotten me this far. It’s done some amazing things. There are times when I look at my C-section scar and I go, how amazing that I carry two babies, they are twins, by the way. They are these beautiful and amazing human beings. I have run a marathon and I have done all these amazing things with this body. It may have some dimples in the wrong places and may not be exactly what I wish it was but it’s beautiful. It serves me and I’m grateful.

We could all say that a little more to ourselves.

That’s the advantage that I didn’t start working out until I was 50. Mine is getting better.

I do think it’s cool that you can look in the mirror and say, “At 50, I started on this incredible journey and my body is changing.” My dad is in his early 80s. My dad and Eric work out on Tonal and my dad’s biceps are amazing from working out. We have to give our bodies more credit. We also have to look at when are we being hypercritical when are we comparing ourselves to airbrush Instagram models and magazine models, which is not realistic. I remember a quote, I think it was from Cindy Crawford or one of those ‘80s models who was like, “Even though I don’t look like Cindy Crawford, I am Cindy Crawford.” Everyone is airbrushed. We need to put that in perspective for ourselves.

I want to circle back to something you said to point out to people that every time you’re on here, I start with rattling off your credentials so people understand that you’re worth listening to. You said something that proves you’re worth listening to more than any of those credentials, which is you gave advice to your teenage child and they listened.

Your daughters are the same age as my daughter. If I say that to my daughter, she’s like, “I’m good, mom.”

“What sort of witchcraft are you doing?”

A lot of people have been trying to get me to write a book about parenting teens because I actually have teenagers who love to spend time with me and I love to spend time with them and hang out. I do have some magic witchcraft up my sleeve.

I am very jealous of that. Enjoy every moment.

I really am.

I look forward to tweaking the intro to saying, “Five bestselling books.”

Me too. Once I find the energy to write that next one.

Thank you so much for joining us. Until next time, where can people find you?

You can find me in InStyle magazine, Hump Day with Dr. Jenn. Every Wednesday, I have a new column that comes out. Also on Instagram and all social media @DrJennMann.

We have more new instructors.

It’s cool because all three tread instructors were announced. They’re all doing their premiere live runs. We’re starting with Kristen Ferguson. She had her premiere run on Monday night. I have heard many amazing things. Her energy was fabulous. She was amazing. Not only is she our newest running instructor, but she is also a proud mom of two. We don’t have a lot of instructors that are moms. We have a few but it’s cool to have a brand new one already have kids. That’s neat.

We also have Daniel McKenna.

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He had his premiere run. I have heard nothing but amazing things. He has great energy is what I’m hearing and he’s funny. He has an amazing Irish accent, which all the ladies are very excited about. He is originally from Ireland, that’s why he has an Irish accent.

He talks in his video that he was born in Ireland and they came from not a lot of means. He’s worked very hard to make it where he is. That’s pretty cool. There’s not a lot of instructors that talk about humble beginnings. Maybe they have them, but they haven’t talked about them. That’s pretty cool and unique as well. If you haven’t had a chance to take that, I recommend it. If you want to follow him on Instagram, it’s @TheIrish_Yank.

There’s a third instructor.

Marcel Dinkins is the third instructor. She had her premiere run on Wednesday, September 1st. I am very excited to see hers as well. This is a fun trio of instructors. I like that they are very different from the instructors that we have on the tread now. I like that there’s a lot of energy and there are two women. I’m excited about this. I am planning to take all three of these runs back to back to back. They are each twenty minutes. I thought that would be a good way. I wanted to do them but I was doing my Tonal because I’m back on Tonal. I had to get my strength in so now I’m going to get my cardio in. That’s 60 minutes starting off the day. I’m very excited.

Peloton released a video of Peloton instructors surprising Peloton members.

This is pretty fun. Apparently, Peloton invited several members to come into the studio and do a video to the instructors, thanking them for being awesome. Unbeknownst to these members, the instructors were there and they came out to surprise them and meet them. The video is heartwarming. I was fully prepared for how sweet it was going to be. I was like, “I already know it’s going to be sweet. I’m not going to cry.” I still ended up in tears by the end. Seeing people meet the instructors that mean so much to them, especially in this year of the pandemic where we haven’t been able to go to the studio and we haven’t been able to see the instructors. That means so much to us in person.

This is amazing and heartwarming. It’s cool. You can see that it’s COVID times because they’re like, “Am I allowed to hug you?” They all stay away but it’s the coolest. The last one was my favorite, Doctor G and seeing her meet Dr. Chelsea Jackson Roberts for the first time. It gets me every time I watched this. I’m getting goosebumps again because they both have such warm lights with them and you can see how sincere they both are. It gets me every time.

They were showing it from both angles at once.

I love that Peloton did that and I love that they shared it so that we could all see it.

A few weeks back, we announced that Christine D’Ercole got engaged. Now she’s trying on wedding dresses. Don’t worry. These are not the ones she selected, ruining anything for the groom.

I would hope not because she put it on social media. She said these were half of them. She talked about what she liked and didn’t like about each one. She’s crowdsourcing this. She’s like, “You guys tell me what you like on each one.” She’s wanting to know people’s opinions on them. If you haven’t seen it, you can go to her Peloton Facebook, which is Christine D’Ercole-Peloton. Find the post and you can then vote on your favorite details in each dress. I thought it was funny that even John Mills has voted. I’m just going to say. Everybody is out there voting. I love it.

A sad and sweet touching story about one of the Marines who died in the attack in Afghanistan with the suicide bomber. Kendall wrote a very nice post about her.

It was Nicole Gee, that was the Marine in question. She was also a Peloton member. Kendall did not know Nicole like they never met. Some people reached out to Kendall and said that Nicole was following her on Instagram and she had tagged Kendall in three stories. It meant so much to Kendall that this woman was out there. She feels bad that they didn’t connect. She also did this wonderful tribute to her and her family. The lesson that she left was, “You never know who you touch, connect with, or make an impact on. I feel grateful that I may have made a slight impact on you, Nicole, but know that your impact on my life will be forever far greater. Your spirit will never be knocked out. Thank you.”

That’s a tough one. On a significantly lighter note, InStyle magazine featured Chelsea Jackson Roberts and sharing her five favorite stretching yoga poses.

If you check out InStyle or if you get on our newsletter, you’ll be able to get all of these articles. There’s Chelsea explaining each of the different moves and there’s an image of her doing them. She explains how to do them and more importantly, why you should do them. That’s pretty cool.

There’s a little gift there. We’ve talked about how Sonos was doing stuff with Emma Lovewell where she had a playlist for a national park.

There were a bunch of people doing the national park playlist

PopSugar writes about another Lovewell crafted playlist for Sonos and this one is for an ab workout.

This article is about how to create the perfect workout playlist, which is why I included it because many people ask why or how instructors come up with the playlist they do. I thought this would be another good way to share with people, but there is also a ten-minute core workout. This article will tell you exactly why she picked the classes or why exactly she picked the song she did for that national park playlist. If you were curious, you can find out by reading that PopSugar article.

Peloton gets a quick mention in the New York Post. They had an article about people trying to lose pandemic weight before they have to return to the office and they spotlighted three different people who had gone through that moment. One of them was Terrilyn Brumfield from Texas. She talks about how she did it with the help of Jess Sims, Ally love and Cody Rigsby. I also think it’s interesting that that’s one sentence in this article and the URL of this article is

That’s because everybody knows Peloton gets the clicks.

MarieClaire writes about us open star Sloane Stephens, talking about mental health and Tunde gets mentioned in there.

It’s a quick mention but it’s cool to see athletes mentioning Peloton instructors. We’ve come such a long way when nobody knew who Peloton was to people who are starring there. They’re in the US Open and they’re like, “Tunde keeps me on track mental health-wise.” That’s amazing.

It’s not like Tunde is an instructor that’s been there for the entire run. It’s been a little over a year and a half-ish since she debuted. She’s already gets named dropped at MarieClaire like she’s been famous forever.

Joining us again is Angelo from MetPro. Hello.

Thanks for having me back.

Thanks for joining us again. We have another question for you. We always put you to work when you show up. This one comes from Dina Silver Pokedoff. She’s looking for ideas on how to carb up for a triathlon, but here’s the kicker. Here’s the trick question. She doesn’t eat white flour, wheat flour or rice flour.

Dina, that’s a pretty straightforward one. That’s an easy one. I always say it depends. Instead of saying, “It depends,” I’ll say that this isn’t the only answer. Here’s my first reaction to that, potatoes and bananas. Here’s the trick. If you prefer, I’m guessing you’re probably because you’re avoiding the wheat. You’re probably used to maybe eating some sweet potato or yam. The challenge there is can it be getting enough volume. The trick is mashed potato, mashed sweet potato, and you can get a little bit more volume taking off the skin. It takes out a little bit of the fiber, which isn’t going to be a bad thing in this case. I find that it’s a little easier to eat. Still, volume is enough to where you’re not going to want to try and do this in one meal. You’re going to want to spread it out over the day a day or two before, depending on how you like to carb load before your events.

That would be a great option. In between, add an extra banana or two for a day or two before. That’s a simple way of getting extra carbs. In the bodybuilding world, when I’m doing a carb increased for some of my clients, we’ll use white potato. There are some caveats. It is a little higher glycemic but in this case, that’s not always a bad thing. You have to see if your body tolerates it. You never want to experiment even a healthy food on race day. You want to do this before. You want to try these things out and you can try either sweet potato, yam, white potato, and most people tell me they do pretty well with bananas. Especially if they have a gluten intolerance, they’re staying away from flour, wheat and things like that. There are a couple of things you could try adding to your normal routine.

Can she add butter to any of these?

No. Here’s the catch with that. You’re increasing gradually over a few days your carbohydrate intake, as long as you’re keeping your fats in check and within reason. I don’t want you to clog your arteries all in one sitting. Don’t cut off two sticks of butter. That’s not the end of the world. Typically, with race day in mind, what you want is as much of the available carbohydrates to be used as energy, which means slowly increasing the digestive time, not slowing it down. When you add fat to a meal, that’s going to slow down the digestion rate and how quickly your body utilizes that.

That’s usually a good thing when we want to look at steady energy balanced meals. Include a little bit of fats. Typically, my go-to fats are going to be healthy oils and avocados and things like that. It would not be the end of the world. Of course, degree of moderation. If there’s a little bit of butter here and there mixed in to make some mashed sweet potatoes or something like that, especially the day before or a couple of days before the race.

Does it make a difference if it’s butter versus margarine?

You can actually use either. For the purpose of answering that question, they’re both going to act similarly. I’ll leave it up to you guys to debate which one’s the healthier one.

You added a potato for what you have me doing, which I first thought was racial profiling because I’m Irish. I’m relieved to hear that you recommend it to other people. I was a little worried, but what you were saying about the skin, was I supposed to eat the skin?

You can eat the skin.

It’s not crazy to eat the skin of the potato, Tom. We’ve been over this.

I don’t want to eat the skin of the potato. Thank you so much for joining us. Until next time, where can people find you? is the best-kept secret of savvy snackers across the country.

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They announced that there will be no live glasses in England from September 4th through September 13th.

It’s funny because on our Zoom call, Danielle Verwey was on the call and she was predicting during that Zoom call, we were talking about where all the instructors were in the world. Because Robin had been in the UK, she felt that they were very close to opening up the UK studio, the long-term one. For people who are new to Peloton, way back before the pandemic, Peloton was getting ready to take the small studio that they opened and open the large long-term studio in the UK. The pandemic happened and everything shut down. They were unable to open the studio as planned. Fast forward to now, we think it’s going to happen between 9/4 and 9/13 or shortly thereafter. Maybe they’re doing all the opening activities between 9/4 to 9/13 but it’s coming soon. writes about Peloton and its continued anti-racism initiative.

I’m not going to go into the initiative itself. I thought it was cool that did an entire feature on it. We talked about this a couple of times and we talked about it recently. It was one year since the initiative dropped. If you go to One Peloton Pledge, you can read the entire pledge, but Peloton has done so many things since they started this. This article talks through all of that. It also talks through the series that Chelsea Jackson Roberts and Tunde did together. It’s cool that this entire thing got highlighted.

There are also subtitles available now for live classes.

I forgot to mention this before, but it’s been rolling out on bikes for a couple of weeks. Subtitles have been available for a while on classes that you take that are on-demand, but now they’re on live classes. Although I’m curious to see how long this is going to last, or if somebody gets in trouble because during a live class, it said, “Are you horny?” That is not what the instructor said at all.

I would think they are typing that up on the fly in real-time.

I don’t think they are typing it up. That’s totally speech to text. There’s no way they have the time. It’s instant.

That makes sense because in my head it’s been around for years way before the speech to text was the thing. I always pictured somebody sitting there trying to keep up. In today’s world, they don’t need to do that anymore, but you will have horny moments.

I have no idea. I was like, “What?” I don’t know what the instructor said because that didn’t stick in my mind but “Are you horny?” sure did.

I thought those towels were for sweat.

There’s an article that came out that Peloton has been subpoenaed by the DOJ. I still cannot figure out this one, the Department of Homeland Security.

I have no idea. A lot of people have asked that, “What’s up with Homeland Security?” I don’t know the answer to that. I have no idea if that’s a misprint or if it is Homeland Security.

It’s said in tons of articles.

Honestly, these days that means nothing because people pull from another article. Even if it is true, what on earth could that have to do with any of this? It’s about treadmill injuries. What is Homeland Security has to do with that?

The only thing I could think is Homeland Security also deals with cyber security, but nobody’s mentioned any of that. I don’t get what that has to do with the treadmill injuries. It seems that would be a whole different thing. I’m mystified.

We all can agree that the government has a whole lot of weird bureaucracy. It’s probably something that none of us can fathom because it makes no logical sense. At any rate, we don’t know anything about this. Peloton quietly put out there like, “We’ve been subpoenaed,” and that’s it. We don’t know anything else about it, why and what’s going to happen next, what it looks like.

Watch this space.

A while back, we talked about how there was a Peloton account that claims to be for the Washington Post. There was much debate about whether or not it was real. It was real. Now we know finally who was running it.

I do remember that it was a guy that worked there and he announced the other day that he was leaving. As soon as he left, this person was able to find out finally who it was. It was Ryan Kellett. It was the Post’s most senior director of audience. After this article was written, the author then verified like, “I did verify with Kellett himself. Yes, it was him.” That happened and apparently, the article says, “I can’t explain the secrecy around any of this. I have no idea.”

It sounds like this guy runs their other stuff. He ran their tech and stuff like that. I don’t know why they didn’t want to tell people. Now that that account has been handed off to somebody else, I guess to run that department, you have to be a Peloton user.

It will be interesting because when I posted this and the first time we talked about it too, I had many people reach out to me and tell me that they had gotten high fives from this account. It is a well-known account that high-fives. Not as bad as some people who spam and follow you from ride to ride and won’t leave you alone. At any rate, that mystery is solved and I love how fun they were. They were like, “I have been ridiculously obsessed with this for months. They were preoccupied. The tagline said, “The dumbest mystery has been solved.”

Joining us is Natalie Oven. How’s it going?

How is it going? You sound exactly the same.

I know you already know this, Natalie, but I’m going to change up our interview. Normally, I always start with certain questions that I do. We’re going to go down a different road because you have a different story. I want you to start with a little bit of your career and why you made a change because of health reasons. Lead us through all of that. Your story is interesting.

I was diagnosed with Crohn’s disease when I was sixteen. I knew throughout my life that I was going to have to take things carefully. It is affected by stress, specifically how you handle stress, as well as diet, exercise and things like that. It’s not a cure or anything for Crohn’s but it certainly is something you have to look out for. I knew that going into the whole “I’m going to be a lawyer” thing.

It’s a stressful career.

I didn’t know what else to do because I’m bad at Math. I read, write and argue.

What kind of attorney? What were you specializing in?

I chose to be a prosecutor. I was twelve when I knew it. I went straight from law school to the Assistant State Attorney’s office. My goal is to prosecute homicide cases. Pretty quickly, I went from being a misdemeanor, then you do felony cases, and then they put you into a specialized unit if you don’t want to stay in felony anymore. I ended up handling crimes against children. At some point, after so many trials, the stress did start to get to me.

One day, I felt a flutter. I felt a subtle weird thing with my eyes. A friend had told me she had a retinal tear and said, “You better check that out because that’s not good.” I immediately went to an eye doctor and he was insensitive in the way he gave me my diagnosis. He was like, “There’s no retinal tear but that tumor right there is strange.” I’m like, “What tumor?” He’s like, “You know about the tumor, right? There’s a tumor.” I was like, “Huh?” He’s like, “You don’t even need to be dilated. I could see a tumor.” He didn’t realize he was unloading a bomb. That’s how I found out.

I don’t remember what the name of it was, but it was a very specific thing.

The condition is called IIH, Idiopathic Intracranial Hypertension. Even your brain is stressed is the way that the diagnosis is. The scientific name is pseudotumor cerebri. It is a crazy diagnosis because it’s like a fake tumor.

It wasn’t fake. It was there. What does that even mean?


It still sounds like it does all the tumor things. What’s the difference between the fake one and a real one?

Does that mean it’s not cancerous?


They ought to say that, but the tumor is still there.

They need to lead with the non-cancerous part too. It’s everything about this. IIH needs a publicist or something. I’m not trying to make fun of you. It’s weird how it’s named and what they call it. I’ll try not to be a jerk. What exactly does it do compared to a “regular tumor?”

It presents almost exactly the same. Some people get horrible migraines, not functioning and lots of vertigo. It’s a bunch of pressure that builds up from my understanding. I’m not the doctor. I’m just trying to explain it. For some people, it’s bad that the only choice they have is to get operated on. They don’t exactly remove it but they put a piece in it that makes the fluid pump better. It’s a strange disease but I have more to talk to you about that. It’s not around a lot. It’s about 1 in 100,000 people end up getting diagnosed with it. This is not the way it was phrased to me. It typically only happens to fat or overweight females in their childbearing years.

Your doctor sounds like a real charmer.

Is this all the same guy? I hope you never went back to him again.

Maybe she should stick with him. Is he Dr. House?

He’s the only doctor that we would love to get away with that.

He sounds like at the moment.

It’s all who it affects typically. If you lose weight, there is a drastic reduction in the pressure behind your eyes. They don’t know how or why. I remember sitting there going, “I’m not the fattest girl in the world.” I tried to have a body-positive lifestyle because there’s been a time when Crohn’s was bad where I couldn’t put on weight. I try to be more balanced as far as how I feel about weight. The doctor is like, “This only happens to fat women.”

I bet you were feeling great.

You’re like, “Thanks, doc. I thought the tumor was going to be the thing that made me feel the crappiest now. You crank that down a notch or two on the old feeling-crappy list.”

The medicine they prescribed me was a diuretic. It’s very strange. They give it to people, specifically in the military, who are dealing with altitude sickness. That’s what they give us. I ended up leaving that particular doctor and going to Mayo Clinic.

I feel like that was a good choice.

I feel like whoever your doctor is, the Mayo Clinic is a good choice. Dr. Nick on The Simpsons sounds like he would have been a better choice.

I remember saying, “I could take things harshly. I can suck it up.” I’m used to having a harder exterior but when it comes to your health, you don’t have a hard exterior.

It’s nothing you could control. Something attacked your body, which already feels crappy. I haven’t had that happen. I’m putting myself in that situation. I would think that you feel like your body is betraying you. To get like, “By the way, fatty.” It’s awful.

I remember saying, “I’m not the fattest person in the world.” The doctor goes, “Indeed.” I’m like, “What?”

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He’s like, “Normally, this happens to 5 or 6. Once you get to 7 or 8, then you’re probably okay.” What’s wrong with this guy?

He sounds like he’s not the most socially in-tune kind of guy.

That was the initial experience with him. I went on a crazy diet, the kind where you eat only 500 calories a day of protein.

Was this because the doctor said to do that?


A real doctor told you to do this, not this guy.

It’s to have a baseline and to see if drastic weight loss will affect it. It did affect it in a good way. They don’t know how it’s connected to it. They don’t understand it but they know it is. Going through all that did make it hard to sustain a career as a prosecutor. Maybe other lawyers can check out at the end of the day, but in the line of work I was doing, I couldn’t check out. I need to take a step back and make the lawyering part of my life not all of my life, which it was. Also, to focus on my health, what I love to do, and other things.

When you’re saying that, you almost sound apologetic. As a person who is too hard on myself, I feel like you’re being too hard on yourself. You can’t compare how you are to somebody else because nobody else is going through what you’re going through.

That’s so much pressure on your back to get it right. I personally appreciate that you cared as a prosecutor because sometimes you see instances where people aren’t necessarily checking everything to the degree that they should be, and caring as much about what the end result is. Personally, from my standpoint, I appreciate that you were that person and that it bothered you. That’s the best kind of prosecutor. To me, that was a good thing that you were that into it.

Thank you. I appreciate that. It did take a while and it was depressing. I wrote that when I told you that. I went through depression right after. I don’t know if it’s because I identified so much as a lawyer. I don’t know what is wrong with lawyers but we do that.

A lot of people do that, especially in certain professions. I’m sure a doctor or an attorney, that’s their identity.

You spend so much time becoming an attorney. You had this goal. You worked toward it and achieved it. To have to take a step back, it’s like you question everything. I don’t know how you wouldn’t feel that way.

That is exactly what it was. It was like, “What the hell am I supposed to do now?” I’m only sharing this because other people have this thing where they won’t leave a crappy job or a job that’s not working out for them anymore. I don’t understand that because my body was like, “You have to leave or you will die. This is killing you.” There are people who get hives before they go to work or suffer panic attacks, and they still do this job. I don’t understand why. Especially after 2020, it should have taught us that you don’t have to do a darn thing you don’t want to do as far as career-wise. If it’s not aligning with your purpose, goals and values anymore, or if it’s taking too much out of you, don’t do it. We have a short life to live.

A lot of people are changing jobs. I’m sure somebody is going to say something about it. There are also a lot of people out there who find themselves in situations that are not easy to transition to something else. Maybe they don’t know how or they don’t have the skills.

It’s also the devil you know like, “I know what it’s like here. What if I go somewhere and it’s worse, maybe it’s less money or the hours aren’t as good?” There is a lot of momentum.

2020 made people go, “Not another day.”

A lot of people came out feeling like that. People are changing jobs left and right. You mentioned to me that people were not very supportive of you when you brought this up and said, “This is going on.” It wasn’t like they rallied around you.

I don’t want to overly reveal too much. I don’t want to curse. I got called in and I’ve never been called in for something my whole career. It was because I overdid something as far as preparing for cases when I was going to Mayo Clinic.


You got reprimanded or chastised.

Yes. It was at a time where I’m on these mind-altering meds. I was open about what was happening. I remember going, “What the heck? Now you’re going to do this after all these years and all that?” I remember saying, “I feel like I told you I wasn’t doing well. Maybe you could move me when I got diagnosed to an easier type position where it’s more writing or something like that.” I felt like it was a setup to eventually lay me off because I was sick. Employers are not allowed to do that.

They try to craft these other reasons.

Legally, I know what’s allowed and what’s not but that was the groundwork. I came back from Mayo Clinic and then I was put in a position where it was a lot of writing because that is what I asked for. There were all these people that I covered their cases for them. They didn’t even reach out while I was at the Mayo Clinic. They didn’t show up at my office to be like, “Welcome back. We’re happy everything’s okay.” There were days on end where I went to my office and no one would come in. Nobody would try to do lunch, even in the break room or anything. I would leave and I would talk to nobody.

Persona non grata.

That’s heartbreaking.

It’s really hard for me. If you’re working at home and you’re alone, that’s okay. That’s how it’s supposed to be. When you’re in an office with 90 to 100 other co-workers about your age, all trying cases and doing things, it’s sad.

There’s a difference between being alone and being ostracized.

That’s what happened. I don’t mean to be like, “Woe is me,” because maybe I went inside a lot during that time of sickness. It could be because I wasn’t available to other people either anymore.

That’s maybe a combination. Sometimes people don’t know what to say. I worked with somebody and her teenage son died. I felt awful for her, but I didn’t know what to say because I felt like saying anything brought it up and that’s hard. She had lost a son and I had lost a sister around the same age. I felt like, “I know what my parents went through when they lost my sister.” I wanted to do something for her, but I had no idea what to do. It’s not like we were close so I said nothing. I don’t know that that’s how people felt about what you were going through. I’m sure there was a sense that you got, so you were there. You were the one living it. Maybe it’s some combination thereof.

It probably was. Shortly after that, here comes back Crohn’s. I came back from Mayo Clinic in January and then in May, Crohn’s came rolling back. As things were going well and I started feeling better again, then part of my small intestine had to come out. It was at that point where I’m like, “It is time to quit.” I’ve never quit a job before unless I was going to college or something. I was like, “I quit. I’m done.” No notice, no nothing. I was like, “It’s time to go.” I was like, “I’m happy to give you my two weeks’ notice but I’m going to be recovering from surgery so I don’t know what to tell you.” It took a lot of courage. To any of your readers that are like, “Should I quit?” I empathize with them as far as how much inner turmoil you go through with changing careers or quitting a job that you thought you were supposed to love. This was a lifetime goal for me. This is my dream.

You don’t become a lawyer by accident. You got to set out to do that.

You work hard to do it. Did you have insurance somehow or another way for you to be able to still have your surgery? Not to get too in the weeds but I’m anticipating what somebody is going to ask. You’re going to get DMs about this.

I have a supportive husband who is a federal government employee. He has great insurance so I’m blessed to have that ability to be able to do that and focus on health for a little bit. He was supportive. There were days between the job, the surgery and all that stuff, I would cry into my dog’s legs. She knew when the time comes for mommy to cry because she would give me her legs on the couch and I would cry on top of her. It was pitiful. I was in a sorry state. Between the dog and my husband, that was the cure for all that was ailing me.

When you had a portion of your small intestine removed, did it take a while for you to recover from that?

Yes. After I lost the weight, the brain tumor to go in, now I could barely walk anymore. I had to get my health back because, at that time, I had just gotten back into shape. I started to run again and bicycle a lot. I finally figured out how to clip in.

Indoor or outdoor?

It was outdoor. I was like, “I just got started figuring this out.” I used to leave my shoes on the outdoor bike and somehow try to get in, and I’d stabilize against my car. I did all this stuff and now I can’t even walk anymore.

How defeating.

Because of all these health issues, it got me a little scared. I live in Florida. I don’t want to get overly political but we are a state that stayed open the whole time.

We’re in Missouri. It’s the same thing.

We hear you.

COVID was maybe a little more scary for people with autoimmune issues and things like that because I didn’t want Crohn’s to come back again. Usually, when I get sick, it affects me much harder. My husband bounces back and I’m bedridden. I couldn’t go to the gym anymore. I wasn’t willing to do that, even though they were open here. That’s about the time my brother donated his bike to me.

That is cool. Wasn’t he using it?

He moved from Michigan back down to Florida and he’s like, “I bought it for Michigan to deal with the winter.” It wasn’t his primary.

It was for bad weather usage.

He was like, “You might take this.” I was like, “Really? Let me try it.” I got on and I was hooked. It was like, “Game on. Do you want $4,000 for the tread too? Okay. Thank you.” We changed the whole room in our house. It was a master bedroom like an en suite or something like that. I converted that to the gym.

Nice and close. Roll out of bed and get work at it.

I even have a cold towel service with a mini spa refrigerator in there.

That’s amazing. I love that.

I bought a water filtration jug thing so I don’t have to go downstairs to fill up my water bottle. I could have it right there.

Is it infused with lemons like at the spa?

Do you have to make the whole room smell like Eucalyptus?

I do put essential oils. It’s mostly because I don’t like the smell of my husband and my sweat combined. Here’s the fun part. He works out with me in the gym and then sometimes, he’ll be doing push-ups as I’m on the treadmill and staring at me.

It’s not in a creepy way but in a supportive way.

She’s like, “Sometimes.”

Sometimes it’s creepy. We haven’t talked about, “Workout time, you can’t creep me out. Stop watching me.” He has a character. His max workout on the bike is fifteen minutes. His usual is 5 or 10 and he will go to 99 to 100 output the whole time. He will try to smoke that cool-down ride.

I don’t get what he’s trying to do. I don’t understand. Peloton can meet you wherever you are. He’s happy and that’s all that matters.

I told him that. I cannot think about being on a bike for 40 minutes.

Maybe if he didn’t go so hard out of the gate, you could.

He only rides with Olivia or Kendall and I’m like, “Hmm.”

You sneak in and filter it so it’s all Denis Morton and Matt Wilpers. That’s the only ride he sees.

He wouldn’t know how to figure it out.

While he’s taken on that Matt Wilpers ride, do push-ups and stare at him. Although he’ll probably dig it. It could backfire or it could be amazing.

He’s like, “This is bonding time. What are you talking about?” He’s not trying to bond. I like Olivia but she’s not my top. Michael likes her because she has this laugh. She’ll be like, “I want you to increase your output to 70,” and she’ll have this laugh. I don’t know if you’ve ever noticed that but she does.

I don’t ride with Olivia. I will take runs with Olivia but I don’t take rides with her because she changes the cadence and the resistance a lot. Maybe it’s better with her Power Zone classes. I haven’t taken them. The way that she makes all the changes doesn’t allow me to settle into the ride. I like her runs. I’ve never noticed the laugh but maybe that’s part of it.

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She does it on her runs too.

Now you won’t be able to unhear it.

That’s the case.

She’ll be like, “It’s time for an eight incline.”

When did you get the bike and the tread?

June or May of 2020 was the bike, and then the tread was 60 days later. I’m like, “0% interest. Hello.”

I know exactly how that conversation went. It was like, “0% interest but since we already got the bike, that’s like we bought the tread. That’s getting $7,000 worth for $4,000 so it’s a deal.”

She saved him money.

I was like, “In 2020, we didn’t have any races, so that saved a ton of money.” I’m near Orlando so I do every Disney race so that is expensive. I registered for the Wine & Dine in November. It’s $368, and then the hotel and all that stuff, and then you eat out. I was like, “All the money we saved last year for not doing races, I’m going to put on the treadmill.”

“So I can do more races.”

It’s wonderful. I love it so much. I bought all the clothes and that doesn’t help either so I didn’t save money there.

I’m familiar. Your husband and I should start a support group.

He doesn’t understand the whole cheetah print Capri obsession.

I don’t think anybody understands that. Why are you paying $400 for a huge bra?

I have one for $600.

That’s crazy.

We’ve gone into the dark side when that happens. The bottom is about to come out on that because I’m sure they’re about to drop that new one.

I saw that picture with Robin and I was like, “They’re bringing back the cheetah print.” It’s cheetah or leopard, I can’t tell.

Let’s just say the cat print.

I tried to explain it to him like, “This is a thing. Health and clothes sometimes pay for themselves. If you want to sell them, you always retain full value.”

He’s like, “Have you ever sold any?” You’re like, “No.”

“Not yet.” I sold a whole bunch of mine and made good money. I hadn’t sold anything in four years so I have stuff from years ago, which is hard to find. I was very happy.

That’s awesome. He doesn’t get the whole collecting the cards because I do that too.

Who doesn’t do that? Who are the people that don’t do that? I do that.

I don’t do it.

My husband doesn’t get it. I wait until he sees them because I’m doing a project of sorts but they’re going to be drawn across the gym attached to the ceiling so he’ll have to look up and see all the cards.

Put them on when he’s staring at you.

Distract him. What has Peloton been like from social support and changing your thought process? What’s all that been like?

If anyone were to interview any of these Peloton instructors, every single one would say they’re living their best life. I’m confident that there’s not one of them that could have envisioned that this was going to be their life, but they know for a fact that this is the best life they are living and that carries through. It lets you know or lets me know like, “You can live your best life too.” Robin quit being a lawyer and never looked back.

It’s funny how many lawyers look up to people who stopped being lawyers. It says a lot about being a lawyer. I know many lawyers that are like, “They stopped being a lawyer?” I’m like, “Do you need a moment alone? You’re really excited.”

It’s almost a celebrity status already. It’s like, “You stop? What do you mean?”

You put all that time in. I get that because it’s that sunk cost thing. It’s hard to quit something even when you know it’s going to make you better because you spent all this time. That was supposed to be the dream, so what now?

I was like, “Hopple is living happy and healthy. Can’t that be the dream? Can’t that be enough?” That was what Peloton pushed me through. I was told this and I knew that this was the truth but that’s how these instructors influenced me. They let me know that I’m enough and I don’t need those labels. Being your healthiest self, waking up every day, taking on the fitness challenge, and physically moving your body and getting out of your head a little bit, that’s what life’s about. That’s what Peloton taught me. Any of those instructors, even the ones that I don’t typically take, I know for a fact that they would say, “You’re doing good. You’re complete exactly as you are.” That’s how I feel about them and that’s fantastic. Good hiring, that’s all I could say. John Foley knows how to hire people. That’s wonderful.

Did you start another career? Are you home? Is that your full-time gig?

I ended up opening my own little practice. I still practice law but it shifted. I typically do a lot of guardian ad litem work. People are getting divorced and judges in Florida don’t want to hear from the child. Sometimes the child has something to say about where they want to live, when and what. My job is bonding with the kids, talking to them, and doing some investigative work as far as like, “Is there one parent that helps with homework? Is there one parent that has no idea what’s going on and is trying to pay less child support?” That’s what I do. I write reports to the court and testify on behalf of the child in what I believe is the best interest for the kid, specifically during a divorce case, which is already a tough time for people, so you’re not seeing their best.

I’m familiar.

We’ve had our own GAO.

I’ve written more than one check to a GAO.

I hope it was a positive experience.

By and large.

For the most part. To the kids, we always explain it like, “That’s your attorney.”

It’s like, “Mom has a lawyer, dad has a lawyer, and now you have a lawyer so your interest doesn’t get lost in the shuffle while we’re in there battling it out.”

Doing what you guys have to do. I don’t blame either side. Everyone wants their kid. Typically, that’s why I get hired. It’s because everyone wants as much time with their child as they can get. Ultimately, that is usually how I tell the kids. I’m like, “Your parents love you so much that they want to make sure that you get to have your say in this. They even spent the money together to have me come on board.”

We didn’t spend it together. I wrote all these checks but I get your logic point.

Sometimes they’re 50/50 split. In your case, no.

We could tell you some stories. It’s a little different in Missouri. When it’s a contentious issue, there were things on Tom’s ex-wife’s side. She had a drug issue. That’s not up for debate. That was factual. Whenever that occurred, the court was hearing one side of the story from her that sounded different from Tom’s. They assigned us one. Since she didn’t have any income, that became Tom’s responsibility.

That happens here a lot too. I do investigate alcoholism, drug issues and stuff like that too. It’s one of those things where it’s hard to tell because people show their best selves for the client, typically. I do try to see through people. Part of the fun as the guardian is to see what people’s intentions are. I love being a guardian. I don’t regret the shift at all. I go to trial. I’ve been in trial a couple of times, but they’ve all been Zoom trials. I never thought that I would be doing Zoom trials.

It’s a good pivot too because it’s still using your legal acumen to help children specifically. That makes a lot of sense.

It’s a great gig. I’m like, “Why didn’t I do this before? It’s easy compared to the lifestyle that I had before.” Before, I would wake up at 5:00 in the morning and do the commute, appeals in the courthouse, and all that stuff. Now with the kids, it’s encouraged for me when I meet them. I wear a Disney shirt. I show them my toys in my office. I have a lot of Disney things and a lot of Marvel comic characters. Kids seem to like that immediately.

I’m sure that makes you approachable. That’s awesome.


They love stickers.

I was also thinking, it’s got to be interesting because you finally have a clientele where they’re always innocent. When you’re an attorney, whether you’re in prosecution or defense, there are going to be times when you’re on the “wrong side.” If you’re a prosecutor, there will be times when that person is innocent and we hope you lose. There are going to be times where your defense was guilty and we hope you lose. Here’s a situation where you always want your client to win because you want them to end up in the best home life that they can possibly have.

It’s a great gig. I love it. It gives you ample time to do other things. That’s what Peloton encouraged me as well because 2020 was rough. A lot of people weren’t fighting over children at that point. They were trying to come together the best they could. Business-wise, I was a little scared, and then another opportunity came. I started an outdoor adventure company with a friend of mine, so it was awesome. Peloton encouraged me with that. In one of Kendall’s mental health rides. There’s something she said that was like, “Go ahead and do the thing.” We started it. It’s called She Can Adventure. Women specifically tend to have a fear about going outdoors, specifically hiking, camping, scared of bears, snakes, specifically in Florida. They don’t spend a lot of time outside, so we created a retreat situation where we’re together. We have guides and things like that. In one of our retreats, we had orienteering so they were left with a compass and a map trying to figure out how to get out of the woods.

Does someone pay to do that?

That’s scary to me. I get lost on the things I should not get lost. I started a job and I’ve driven it for a couple of weeks’ worth of time. I turned the wrong way when I was leaving. How do you even do that? I did.

We teach you not to do that. That’s part of the fun. I’d love to see you at the retreat. You’re with guides the whole time but they let you make your mistakes. Of course, we have paddle boarding, yoga, hiking, and general stuff. The orienteering, a lot of reports came back that that was the most positive experience for them that was out of their comfort zone. We started that company and I love it. I love teaching people who wouldn’t ever think that they’re good at that, and then they end up being quite good at it. The girl who won the competition had never orienteered before her whole life. She was fantastic. She’s better than me. Honestly, it would be my dream if my brother and her would date. I was trying the whole time to push my brother on her.

You’re a matchmaker too.

You had another job opening for her. It’s never-ending.

I was like, “I’m letting you in my family. You’re so cool.”

You can go full circle. They meet at your adventure company, and then you put them together in your matchmaking company, and then when they get divorced, you can figure out which one gets the kid.

You gave me the whole money-making scheme right there where I win at every turn.

That’s recession-proof right there.

What is your leaderboard name?

My leaderboard name is MastaManifestor. My hashtag is #BecsBeast because Becs is my absolute favorite. I have quite a few favorites for different things but I would say Becs would be the best instructor for me. There’s something about her running that seems effortless and probably is quite effortless for her. The way it translates for me is when I’m running, I don’t feel like I’m running that much. I don’t even hear her breathing. You can tell she’s running and then it goes smoothly. I did my first 60-minute run with her and I’m like, “This has been a long time since I’ve been able to go this long, especially on a treadmill.” That’s not usually my thing. It felt effortless. She made it go by. Kendall, when I want to get beat up. It’s like, “You want to emotionally go on a roller coaster.”

You’re starting a new career.

I feel like Kendall will do that to you. Don’t listen to Kendall unless you want to make life changes. Personality mood shifts, if you’re not ready to transform like a butterfly, you need to stop to do Kendall. Emma Lovewell for her music. I’m a ‘90s music fan. Her ‘90s rock rides are my favorite. They’re great. Yoga is Aditi. I do a lot of the platforms in case you can’t tell. You can’t forget about yoga. That’s the supplement to all the craziness that you’re doing to your body. Aditi is probably my favorite yoga instructor.

Know that you are enough. That you don't need any prestigious labels. Share on X

All the Peloton instructors are wonderful. We’re lucky to have so many to choose from.

If you can’t find one based on your personality, something is wrong. You have to find one that you like. For heaven’s sake. For my husband, it’s purely lost in space. It’s always superficial for him.

Whatever gets him there.

He’s on the bike.

It’s not fair. I work out so much longer, I eat healthier, and he looks amazing. I don’t get it.

Men are programmed from a DNA perspective that it’s easier to lose weight and to keep it off.

He eats so much red meat and he chases it with Coke.

It sounds like this is normal.

He eats whatever he eats.

He walks around and he looks great. I’m told, “You’re fat and that’s why you have a brain tumor.” I was like, “What the heck?”

That does seem unfair. That seems a little off.

It’s crazy but I appreciate it. I want to take this last few minutes because I know we have a time constraint but I wanted to say thank you for your show. I do look forward to it on Fridays. Crystal, I appreciate your laugh. I feel like it’s genuine. I don’t tend to hear a lot of laughter in my day-to-day. I try to bring people around my life that are laughy. I would say laugh easily. It’s a good attribute to have. I appreciate that you have that because your laugh is contagious. It even comes across in the show where I start cracking up. I honestly wish I could have met the guy, the one that you always have in first.

John Mills?

He’s like, “How are you doing?”

He’s so funny. He brings energy every week. I don’t know how he does it.

He says, “How are you doing?” I start laughing and I can’t even stop. I appreciate you making a whole show about Peloton. I’m sure Peloton appreciates it too.

Some days less than others maybe.

It’s such a great program. We’re so weird. The Peloton people are weird. Becs, for example, we call ourselves flamingos. I don’t know if you knew that. I wear a flamingo necklace. She liked one of my posts that was connected to the BecsBeast. I started crying and my husband was like, “Get control of yourself. What is wrong with you?” There’s just something special. There’s a magic sauce in Peloton that I just don’t know how to describe because only something like that has to be special to bring somebody into tears over social media life.

I agree with you there is something special and it’s hard to describe. It’s a lot of things, but it’s hard to say exactly why it’s that way. I don’t know but whatever it is, I hope it never goes away.

Maybe he understands it better if it was one of those instructors he stares at.

Maybe if it was Kendall, you would have gotten him.

Maybe. I don’t know what it is. I even wear a flamingo shirt. I have a flamingo figurine in my office.

Do you change your profile picture to the flamingo when you ride or when you run?

I did when she was competing for the Olympic marathon trials. During Pride Month, there was a flamingo with the pride color so I did change it to the flamingo at that point too but typically, it’s just me smiling. I’m overly smiling probably. I feel like it’s just the training between all of that. I’m fully capable. I don’t have to have a formalized training plan that a lot of people do when you’re training for these big races. I just feel like I’m in consistent enough shape where I can do it.

That’s cool.

That’s a great place to be.

People don’t need to take it so seriously especially if you’re signing up for these Disney races and stuff. The likelihood that you’re going to be top five or whatever is probably not likely so why don’t you have fun with it and get yourself in good shape and don’t lose that luster. If you wake up and be like, “I have to do 3 miles today.” That will likely lose the joy of the whole point of doing it. Just like waking up and going, “Emma’s got a rap ride today.” That’s enough. That’s fine. I’m going to do that. I hope that this helps people who are maybe going through health stuff. I’m sure that there are plenty of people who have gotten COVID who probably don’t even feel back to themselves yet. I want to encourage them that getting physical and out of your head a little bit probably will help get through some of these health situations that you’re going through. I do encourage people to go seek health like counseling. I wish I did during that time.

I’m a big fan of talking things out and if people are struggling, that is good advice to do that.

Don’t let your career kill you. That’s the other thing.

Thank you so much for joining us. Before we let you go, remind everybody where they can find you if you would like to be found.

MastaManifestor and you can find me at I did talk to my partner and if they mentioned The Clip Out and they want to register for the retreat in February 2022, we’re going to give them 10% off.

That’s incredible. Thank you.

No problem. I would love to see if people would register and come check it out. We do running, hiking yoga, meditation and orienteering. We are confirmed orienteering, so if you want to get dropped off in the woods and find your way out with a compass., this is your retreat.

More power to you.

That sounds terrifying, but that’s good. It’s good to go outside your comfort zone.

I absolutely get that people would want to do it but me personally, all I want is a refund.

It sounds like this is too much work.

I’m sweating just thinking about it.

We all know you don’t like to sweat, Tom.

I do not.

You’ll never get lost again. I’m tearing up just thinking about Peloton and how wonderful it is and how much it changed my life. It made everything better.

Thank you for taking time out of your clearly busy day to join us. We appreciate it.

Thank you.

I guess that brings this episode to a close. What pre tell do you have in store for people next week?

We have an interview with Michele Kerulis. She is a doctor who does sports psychology and it’ll be a fascinating conversation.

Until then, where can people find you?

People can find me on Facebook at They can find me on Twitter and Instagram, the Bike, and the Tread @ClipOutCrystal.

You can find me on Twitter @RogerQBert or on Facebook at You can find the show online at While you’re there, like the page and join the group. Be sure and sign up for our newsletter at That’s it for this one. Thanks for tuning in. Until next time, keep pedaling and running.

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About Natalie Oven

Natalie grew up in a strict cultural and religious environment where girls and women were not encouraged to do physically strenuous activities. As a child, she spent extensive time reading books and relished the fact that she could go to the library and acquire knowledge about any subject. Natalie had her first experience in athletics by joining the Rugby team in college.

She has run extensively since then and running became a passion. She has completed over 75 half marathons and 2 marathons. As a result of a running injury, Natalie became introduced to yoga. When her favorite instructor left her studio, Natalie decided that she wanted to learn more and became a certified yoga instructor.

She hopes that she can bring the balance to She Can, as yoga and running together created a perfect balance for her. Natalie is a Level 2 Yoga Alliance Instructor as well as a certified coach through Road Runners Club of America. Natalie Oven is the co-manager of She Can Adventure, LLC and plans to spread her enthusiasm for yoga, running, and reading.