TCO 316 | Ultramarathon Runner

316. Peloton & Chill? Are Netflix And YouTube Coming To The Bike? And Our Interview With Scott Jenkins

  • Are YouTube and Netflix coming to the Bike?
  • PSL will be renovated and closed to members for 6 weeks.
  • Lanebreak Tread launches this week.
  • Peloton announces Yoga Focus Flow for Rowers.
  • More Americans are working out at home.
  • Peloton stores celebrated Pride on June 24.
  • Dr. Jenn – My wife is using me as a human garbage disposal!
  • Ben Alldis & Erik Jager will be teaching from PSNY in July.
  • Alex Toussaint released his first outdoor class.
  • Tunde was on the New Jersey PBS show Table For All.
  • Cody Rigsby was on Dave Holmes’ In Transit.
  • Hannah Frankson was on the Quotes By Christie podcast.
  • Alex Karwoski was on his brother’s podcast (Tag Along With A Pro).
  • Runner’s World included Selena Samuela as part of a series about Women who found Mental Strength through running.
  • Emma Lovewell was the keynote speaker for Johnson & Johnson’s Global Activity Challenge.
  • Angelo/MetPro – Determining your “ideal” weight.
  • LP Giobbi made an in-studio appearance.
  • Lululemon can’t move Mirrors no matter how much they mark them down.
  • Does Apple have unannounced fitness features for Vision Pro?
  • Tempo adds 3D body scans and dynamic reps.
  • No live classes on 7/3 & 7/4 – all encore
  • 8 new on-demand dance cardio classes.
  • New scenic classes are available.

All this plus our interview with Scott Jenkins!

Listen to the podcast here


Peloton & Chill? Are Netflix And YouTube Coming To The Bike? And Our Interview With Scott Jenkins

I’m warning everybody right now. She’s tired and crabby. 

Not everybody got a nap. That’s all I’m saying.

I don’t know what you’re talking about. That was show prep. That’s what that is.

Explain to me how that was show prep.

Now, I’m all prepared.

You weren’t prepared before you fell asleep?


How does sleep prepare you for this?

Angelo says you have to take rest days. Those are important. You’re about to see how crabby she is. What pray tell do you have in store for people?

Stuff about Peloton.

I will take stuff about Peloton for 200.

Do you want to know the specific stuff about Peloton?


We’re apparently going to be streaming on all of our equipment. By streaming, I don’t mean a pee joke, Tom. I feel like that was coming next. I mean Amazon or YouTube or maybe other things.

Third-party streaming platforms.

Also, Lanebreak for the Tread officially launched. Plus we have a whole bunch of other updates. We also have a visit from Dr. Jenn, and we talk about a listener whose wife is using him as a human garbage disposal. We also have a visit from Angelo at MetPro. We’re going to talk about how you can determine what your ideal weight is. We also have a bunch of news on Peloton competitors and a bunch of things that you need to know going into the 4th of July weekend.

We will also be talking to Scott Jenkins.

He is so funny. That interview was hilarious.

He’s a very avid runner.

He’s a British runner.

He runs on the left side of the road.

He also is going to be running with Susie Chan. They run together from time to time. They know each other from the running social circle there in the UK.

From the upper tier running circle.

Scott Jenkins is like, “I’m not an elite runner.” I think that if you run three 200-mile events within 90 days, we’re going to go ahead and call you an elite runner.

Apparently, part of being a runner is telling people that you’re not a runner. By that standard, I am very much a runner.

You’re really not a runner.

The runners tell you they’re not runners. Therefore, I am a runner because I don’t do it at all. Before we get to all that, shameless plugs. Don’t forget we’re available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google. Wherever you find podcasts, you can find us. Not Stitcher. That one is going away.

That’s not us. Stitcher is no more, in case you miss the news.

Stitcher is going away. If you are listening on the Stitcher app, you need to have a backup plan for your podcast.

Head over to Goodpods. That’s a good one.

While you’re there, be sure and follow us so you never miss an episode. Maybe leave us a review. That’s super helpful. You can find us on Facebook, While you’re there, like the page and join the group. You can also find us on YouTube,, where you can watch these episodes in HD magnificence or mediocrity, depending on which one of us you’re looking at.

I was just thinking of people’s nasty comments.

We have a Patreon,, where you can get these episodes ad-free. If we get them early, you get them early. Sometimes you’re getting them almost a full day in advance. You can use those to wager with your non-Patreon subscribing friends and make a little extra money. You can make back the cost of your Patreon just like that. Finally, we have a newsletter at, where you can get all of the links and things like that sent to you on a mostly weekly basis unless I’m traveling and getting lazy. There’s all that. Let’s dig in. Shall we?

We shall.

It would appear that in the not-too-distant future way deep in Space 13, you will be able to stream things like YouTube, Amazon Prime, and maybe Netflix on your Peloton screen devices.

What we know for sure is that a beta test is in progress. It’s happening. What we also know is there are no licensing agreements in place. Anything could change. I think a big thing we don’t know the answer to and I can’t wait to find out is whether you will be able to get it on all versions of the equipment. What I mean by that is if you go back to the early days, those monitors have changed over the years. If you still have an old monitor, are you going to be able to use this entertainment icon?

My guess would be no. The bigger question is at what point in the evolution of the screens will you be able to start streaming third-party services?

That’s a good question. Also, we have heard rumors that there is another streaming service coming besides Amazon and YouTube. The reason that we are theorizing Netflix could be in the running is because of Barry McCarthy’s Netflix history.

He’s the former CEO of the company. You think that would be one phone call and you’re done. Also, that seems to be the one that gets requested the most if you are going to go down that road. It does make sense that Prime Video is instantly in the mix because they sell a lot of stuff on Amazon. That makes sense.

The other thing to talk about is the cultural shift. For years, the whole thought process has been that our instructors are the product. You shouldn’t be wasting your time watching YouTube, Amazon Prime Video, Netflix, or things like that. People come for the instructors and we want them to stick around for the instructors. This is a very big shift from a strategy standpoint.

It sure is. There are households that have snubbed their nose at Peloton because, for whatever reason that I will never understand, they have this giant screen in front of them and they want to watch Netflix. If that’s the case, they’ve been like, “If I can’t watch it on my screen, then I don’t want it.” They have gone to other treads. I’ve seen this happen with treadmills especially.

To me, this has never been a big deal. I love the fact that Peloton engages me. I don’t need any of these things, but there are a lot of people who very much feel differently about it. If you have two people in a household, one of which is a huge Peloton fan, one of which is I like to pedal slowly while I look at something. It’s a great way to bring both into the mix. We know that Peloton’s big push right now is to get to a bazillion subscribers. This is one of the ways you do that.

I can’t help but think that part of the thought process is one, there has been a shift in leadership. Also, they’re thinking, “If we’re going to try and become software-based, and then if people want the instructors, they’re there. If they want something else, we are not going to stop them from buying a piece of equipment over it.” For years people have said, “Why wouldn’t you let me do this? It’s my equipment. I can use it however I want. That seems shortsighted.” I don’t know. Maybe it’s a thing that made sense at the time and now it doesn’t. Now that they’re the name brand in this field, maybe it’s not a hill they need to die on anymore.

It’s another way that Peloton can meet you wherever you are. If you truly want to democratize fitness, and even if you don’t want to democratize it and you just want to be everywhere, the less barriers you put up for people, the more chance you have of them getting your product. From a growing subscriber standpoint, this makes total sense.

You could see a situation where someone comes for Netflix and stays for Cody Rigsby since it’s right there in front of them.

I don’t know how that doesn’t happen.

I don’t get why you would pay $45 a month or whatever it is now to then just turn around and watch Netflix.

I wouldn’t do it anyway. If I’m going to get on the bike or the tread, I want to be engaged. I want somebody to be there with me. I know what the gym was like. Whenever I went to the gym, I did this slow boring pace.

I think it makes less sense for the bike than it does for the tread. A lot of people are like, “I want to get on the treadmill and listen to a podcast and just walk,” or “I can get my jog going. I don’t necessarily need to have direction in the same way you do on a spin bike.” It makes absolutely no sense on a rower.

The important thing though is that this ends up meaning that it’s going to open so many different content onto a Peloton platform that it was not intended for, like us. We’re going to be there right in front of you.

You don’t need to be clipped out anymore to listen to The Clip Out now. We’re changing the name of the show to The Clip In or Out, whatever you want to do.

It’s going to be a little longer. It’s going to be harder to put on a logo.

It’s going to make it harder for the theme song to rhyme.

Also, there are so many YouTube workouts. It’s like, “I would not use them. Why would I pay $50 a month,” but there are people that will. I know that. For people who are super into like, “I got to have my marathon training. It’s got to tell me exactly what to do for six hours while I run,” that’s because it would take me that long to run those that many miles. I guess it’s a good way to do that.

Here’s the question. Will you still be able to access Netflix or YouTube if you’re not paying for membership?

I don’t think that you can. The way that it’s being described to me is it is an entertainment icon within the Peloton ecosystem. It’s inside the platform. If you don’t have the software and you’re not paying for the software, then you wouldn’t be able to log in, but then people jailbreak. That’s what they’ve always done.

If you’re going to jailbreak, then none of this ever mattered.

They don’t have to jailbreak if you are already subscribed.

There probably will be households where the husband wants one thing and the wife wants another, or vice versa. Although, we all know it’s probably the husband that wants to watch Netflix versus the wife.

He’s probably watching basketball or something.

Now that you can watch TV on your Peloton device, I think that they will start merging it and you will see Peloton-based TV shows. Would you like to know some titles of TV shows that I think you can look forward to?

I would. Bring it on.

Here we go. Jess King of Queens, Aditi Five-O, Make Room for Cody, Emma Loveboat Well, Jenn Sherman and Peabody. I got a million of these all day long. Eight Simple Joslyn Thompson Rules For Dating My Teenage Daughter, Who’s the Ross, Twilight Arzon. I got a little theme here. Adrian of Jeanie. That one is a bit of a stretch. Leanne Hainsbewitched, Tunde At A Time, Everybody Loves Ramon, Did I do Matty About You? I don’t know if I’ve done that one yet. I have so many here, Adami 12.

I don’t know that. Is that like Benny Adami? Is that what you’re trying to say?

We will take that one out and post. Yo Jack or Yo MTV Raps, Andy Speer Factor, the Fresh Prince of Wilpers, Breaking Rad, and The Becs Files. She’s going to take that one. She’s like, “I have a thing and I’m calling it The Becs Files. That’s great.” Also, former instructor Oliver Lee has two shows in the works, Candid Camera and Different Strokes. You have all that to look forward to as you stream shows. It’s coming this fall to Peloton BC.

It’s going to be quite the lineup.

Peloton Studios in London is getting a major makeover.

They are even though it has just opened.

I know. It’s so new.

Remember how much everything has changed. Originally, the new store was supposed to open all the way back in 2020, but then the world changed. It got put off all the way until they opened the New York Studios back up to people. Now, it’s being reopened. They’re going to do a big makeover, and they’re going to make it much more similar to the experience that New York has.

A lot of people have been talking about this like, “What does that mean?” It seems this is more about the virtual experience. This isn’t going to change very much for the members in the studio, but for at home, it’s going to change the experience. During this time, which is not insignificant, it will be August 7th through September 22nd, the studio will be closed to members. My understanding is the lobby and the studio will not be open. However, you’re not going to be not having content. They’re still going to be creating content. They’re still going to be dropping content. They have taken care somehow of AFO and Peloton On Tour.

The biggest takeaway from this is that you will not be able to schedule classes to take in-person because they won’t be there, but everyone is still not going to hear this. Please, for the love of God, let’s all pitch in. When we see those, “Why can’t I book classes,” share this article with them. That’s why you can’t book a class in PSL.

There’s a good answer.

Hopefully, you weren’t planning on going because it’s not going to happen.

If you do plan on going anyway, bring a hard hat and a hammer.

See if you can fight your way in.

They could use your help. We broke the news about Lanebreak heading to the tread. Now we have even more information.

It is released today. We have confirmed at this point that we’re only going to see it on tread, not Tread+ because it does auto-incline on the hill. That’s why it is only for the tread. As we talked about before, I suspect that we will see this after the recall period is over.

After all the CPSC stuff is resolved and in our rearview mirror.

We got a long wait. I’m not going to lie. It’s going to take a while, but let’s remember this fellow Tread+-ians. This is very important.

The few, the proud, the stubborn.

Our treads are better.

They should be. They charged you more for them.

Plus is in the name. It goes up to 15%. We’ve got free mode even though it’s never programmed anymore, and we’ve got the slats. Most importantly, the slats. When you feel sad about Lanebreak, remember your slats. It will come eventually. We got to be patient, but for those of you who do have it, this is going to be cool because they took all of the things on the bike and they totally redid it. They changed how it looks completely, the mechanic for Lanebreak treads. It’s going to be easier to see the changes as you’re walking, running, or jogging.

We also have confirmed that they did give this very wide pace-based difficulty option so that you can use it for walking, jogging, or running. We also know that we are going to be able to use the hill. The tread adjusts the incline automatically and it follows the curve that is shown on the 3D world displayed on the tablet. That’s new, 3D. Also, they have this new mechanic in it that’s going to reward you for interval workout design. You’re still going to get your interval workouts just like you do on the bike, which is fantastic. They made sure to update again those visuals and controls with running and walking in mind. Do we want to talk about the music?

Let’s talk about the music.

As they launch the Lanebreak, we are going to have pop, electronic, RnB, hip-hop, rock, metal, country, and Latin. Most exciting is there are custom levels that are going to be featuring the music of DJ and producer Tiesto, including tracks from his latest album Drive. That is very cool. They’ll press release the whole thing from DJ Tiesto. I did not know he was a Peloton user. Now I know. Very cool.

Peloton also announced Yoga Focus Flow for Rowers.

They’ve added these. Right now, we have all the cross-training for running and tread, but now we are going to be adding focus flow for rowers. There are already classes there in the collection. You can find these under cross-training, and yoga for cross-training. So far, we have a 10-minute class with Ross and a 20-minute class with Kirra. Lots of cool stuff, and of course, they already have classes for runners in there as well.

These are cool and I’m glad to see that they are making sure to add cross-training yoga in. It’s a good way to push you to the yoga classes. We should all be doing more yoga. It’s good for us. You need to have this mobility. We always talk about the fountain of youth is to do strength training as you get older. You have to, but if you don’t do the mobility, you can’t move. If you want to stay young as long as possible, mobility and strength training are important. You need to do those two things.

Since the end of COVID, or I guess it’s over. I don’t wear a mask anymore.

Nobody worries about it anymore.

I’m assuming it’s over. I don’t have a mask and I’ve had nine shots, so I think it’s over. All the stories have been about how Americans are heading back to the gym. For some of them, they certainly are. There’s an article from that says, “They are, but not as many. People are still more likely to be working out at home.”

That is quite a graphic there.

I like it when things are graphic.

It says, “How many times, how often do you exercise at home versus a gym?” People say out of home, 52%. That’s several times a week versus at a gym several times a week, 42%, then several times a month at home, 25% versus at a gym, 26%, then a few times a year at home, 23%, and at a gym, 32%. That’s interesting. The people who go less, they workout at a gym more often.

For the people that only do it a few times a month, it’s almost identical between at home or a gym. Of the people that only do it a few times a year, 23% do it at home a few times a year, whereas 32% are lying to themselves.

What I take this as is the more often you workout, the more often you workout at home. If you’re a person who occasionally works out, you might do it more often at a gym, but you’re not going to be consistent. Consistency is key, therefore, workout at home. That’s what I read.

Humans aren’t designed to sit at a desk all day, sleep away, or sit in cars. Somewhere along the way, we have mistaken comfort for happiness. Share on X

This is so subjective because some people like the ritual of going to the gym.

They do and that will never change.

That will never change for them and that’s fine. I do think that the vast majority of people benefit from having it right at their fingertips. It’s an obstacle removed. If you have a passion for going to the gym, that doesn’t need to change. That’s great but for most people, that’s a lot to contend with, especially if you’re just starting. It will be interesting to see if we see this study again in 5 or 10 years and if that’s changed at all.

I feel like over time, that working out at home number is only going to get larger because of that 42%, I bet you at least 50% to 60% of those people are people who have been working at a gym for a long time and they like it, and they don’t see the need to change. Many people have trouble taking that first step going into a gym because they’re intimidated.

They’re not comfortable. They feel out of place. They feel like people are going to make fun of them, whether it’s because of their size or their lack of knowledge about how to utilize the equipment. The whole thing is weird and awkward. For guys, there’s always that one guy that walks around the locker room complete with his junk hanging out like no big deal.

They’re in the women’s locker room too.

It’s a big deal. I promise you, sir. Put it away.

I think I’ve told you the story about the shower Nazi.

Over time, you’re going to see this disparity widen. That is my guess.

It’s interesting looking at the data at the bottom. I don’t know if you noticed this, but it says that there are 2,000 responses from 6/15 to 6/21. That’s how many are for at home. For the gym, the responses were 13,000 from 5/22 to 6/21. Who did this? That’s bullsh*t. This disparity would be wider had these been more equal timeframes.

That is weird that the groups aren’t the same. I don’t know what the logic is there. Maybe they’ve decided to purport that this is more of a representational proportion of the two groups within the society. I don’t know. That’s weird. Also, it’s all self-reported data, so you always got to give that side out.

That’s true.

Peloton celebrated Pride in the stores on the 24th.

All of the stores in Canada and the US got together and celebrated on the 24th. You could come into the store. You could have colorful Pride donuts, DIY Pride bags, and Pride banners. There were all kinds of cool stuff there.

I was focused on the donuts. It’s weird though. It’s like, “Go to the Peloton store, and get yourself a donut.” It’s counterintuitive.

It is counterintuitive. We wouldn’t know because we’re here in St. Louis.

We don’t have a store anymore. That’s more and more common. We used to be left out. Now, we’re probably more included in the group of not having a store. Does that make you feel a little better?

No, but thanks.

Coming up after this, we’re going to talk to Dr. Jenn. She’s going to answer a question from a listener whose wife is using him as a human garbage disposal. She’s watching what she eats. She’s making him eat all the stuff and living vicariously through her husband, and he’s getting frustrated. Stick around.

Joining us is Dr. Jenn Mann, licensed marriage, family and child therapist, and sports psychology consultant. You may know her from VH1’s Couples Therapy with Dr. Jenn or VH1’s Family Therapy with Dr. Jenn, or her long-running radio show, the Dr. Jenn Show. She’s written four bestselling books including The Relationship Fix: Dr. Jenn’s 6-Step Guide to Improving Communication, Connection and Intimacy. It’s Dr. Jenn.


Welcome back.

For our audience, it might not feel like you’ve been gone because you had taped a bunch of stuff before the unfortunate passing of your mother. This is our first time recording with you since then.

Many of our listeners sent you so much love. I hope you got to see it. We were all sending our love and thoughts.

The outpouring was amazing. My mom, Cynthia Weil, was incredible. She’s not just a great mom, a great grandmother, and a great wife, but also an incredible lyricist and an iconic groundbreaking woman in the music industry. I’m glad to be able to celebrate her and share her legacy with people. Right now, I’m doing my therapy thing. I’m also overseeing their catalog and getting the word out, and sharing incredible music that my mom wrote with my dad.

She had a song featured very prominently in the Barbie trailer. I’m assuming you signed off on that one.

I very much did. That was a fun one.

Just to try to make you laugh, do you ever get offers for stuff and you’re like, “Uh-uh?”

We turned down an offer for a shooting game that involved a lot of violence and killing police officers. We opted against that. I have accepted some things that you would expect me not to because they involved meat, but then we donated money to do an investigation of the factory farming system. Sometimes it’s good to fund a good operation.

That’s a good way to offset that. It’s like buying those eco credits for the ozone.

It wasn’t specifically a meat company, but it was a very well-known organization that does a lot of not-great practices with meat. Although this company is doing more vegan and vegetarian options, which is great for me as a vegan. I was able to walk that line but was thrilled to be able to give some money to Mercy for Animals.

Fun fact. There’s a period of time when Shaggy and Scooby-Doo becomes vegetarian.

I did not know that.

Casey Kasem who did the voice for Shaggy until his passing became a vegan late in life. He insisted that Shaggy couldn’t have any meat sandwiches. They got very frustrated because it cost them a deal with Burger King. When they shifted to Matthew Lillard because of the movie, they brought it back in. There is about a ten-year period where you will not see Shaggy eat meat.

I love that. That’s a great story.

You got all kinds of stuff in there.

We are glad you are back.

We missed you.

We wrote an article for the website and shared it. It’s about your mom. It was great to show people that when people say legend, it is not just this lady passed away and we want to be nice to her. Both of your parents are legit jaw-dropping legends with the things that they wrote.

My mom has won over 112 BMI awards. You’ve Lost That Loving Feeling is the most-played song ever of the 20th century.

It was literally the most popular song of the 20th century.

It’s a great song.

My parents won multiple Grammys. They’ve been inducted into the Songwriters Hall of Fame and the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. They just inducted my mom into the Women’s Songwriters Hall of Fame. My mom is an incredible icon. I’m very proud of her and I’m very proud to share her music with people. You can also check out one of my projects. I’m working on their social media. Check out @MannWeil on Instagram and follow my parents because there’s going to be a lot of fun stuff coming.

That’s good to know. We will have to include that in the show notes.

We have a question that might bring the vibe down a little.

I’m ready to bring the vibe down. Let’s do it.

This is from Dennis Clemente. He says that his wife is on a strict diet and uses him as a surrogate eater. He supports her on her diet, but he resents being used as a human garbage can. She’s constantly pushing rich and unhealthy food on him.

It’s not funny but it’s funny.

I will be honest. I don’t know if he wrote this as a joke. There were no emojis to indicate that it was, but I’ve seen people in this situation. I felt like even if he was, this is still a great discussion.

I have too, and I’ve seen it done in a lot of different ways. There are times when someone who is very restrictive will not finish their food. They can’t bear to throw it away so they try to make another family member eat it. There are times when one person is very restrictive and then they are trying to get the family member to eat the foods that they don’t allow themselves, and they want to smell it. They want to ask about the taste of it. They want to have a vicarious eating experience.

The bottom line with this is that the person who is restricting is restricting way too much. If you are creating this dynamic in your family or your relationship, you need to allow yourself to eat some of your forbidden foods. To me, this is crossing that line into eating disorder land. If you are not allowing yourself to eat foods and you’re pushing them on someone else so you can have the experience, then you are way too deprived. It’s time to work with a therapist who specializes in eating disorders. It’s time to work with a dietitian who has a real understanding of restrictive eating and how unhealthy that can be.

Dennis needs to make boundaries. He needs to not alter his food intake based on what his wife wants him to eat. He needs to be able to eat what he wants and listen to his own body. You know how I am about listening to your body, listening to what it craves, eating what you want, and not eating because someone else is telling you to eat something or because you should. This falls under that should category.

I don’t want to see him doing this even though I’m not in their house actually seeing it. This is not good for him and it’s not good for their dynamic. He’s actually enabling her eating disorder by doing it. He needs to make a boundary and say, “I’m so sorry but I can’t do this anymore. I need to listen to my own body. If you’re struggling and need me to do this, then we need to get you to therapy or to work with someone who understands eating disorders.”

It’s like being a cuckold but for food. “Go out and eat that and then come back here and tell me all about it.”

That’s Dr. Jenn After Dark

I knew I’d get you there.

That was a different topic there, Tom.

That was a different form of eating, potentially.

Thank you. That was good advice.

Thank you so much for joining us. Until next time, where can people find you?

On all social media @DrJennMann. I post my Peloton workouts on my stories and you can see me coming back after the death of my mom and after our crazy 21-mile walk-run that we did in Big Sur.

Thank you.

Ben Alldis and Erik Jäger are heading to the Big Apple.

They’re going to be teaching from PSNY in July. There are going to be classes on June 10th. There’s going to be a 30-minute ride with Ben on July 14th and July 15th. There are going to be two separate classes with Erik. He’s going to be teaching both of those in English. That’s pretty cool.

That’s a great opportunity for people to see international instructors in the US.

It’s a nice change-up.

Alex Toussaint has released his first outdoor class.

I don’t know if you remember but we talked about this a while back. He had teased like, “I know, everybody, you’ve been asking for outdoor classes.” One popped up on June 22nd and it was a 20-minute power walk. More have been promised, so there will be more to come.

Tunde popped up on a show on PBS, specifically for PBS New Jersey. It’s called A Table for All: An African Homecoming.

They talked about traditions in Nigeria because I believe that they both have Nigerian roots, the host and Tunde. They talked about that. They also do some other things in the PBS studio, like a studio tour and an art lesson.

That was made specifically for the New Jersey PBS affiliate, but you can watch it online. If you want a link to that, you can sign up for our newsletter and it will be in this week’s batch of links. Cody Rigsby appeared on the show In Transit. It’s a web-based show for Esquire Magazine. It’s hosted by former MTV personality and St. Louis native, Dave Holmes.

I didn’t know he was a St. Louis native.

He is from St. Louis. He made it on MTV. I don’t know if you remember. Years ago in the ‘90s when they still had music videos, they had a contest called Wanna Be A VJ. It was like a reality show. They tested in. I forget who won, but it was this weird stoner dude who ended up winning. Dave Holmes came in second. It was funny because Dave Holmes is not so flashy or MTV but he knew his stuff and he’s super likable.

He came in second and it tells you a lot about those sorts of shows in that all these years later, he’s the guy who’s still working. He’s the guy you still see popping up in things, and people liked him so much. They found a role for him, even though he didn’t win the contest. He’s nice. I spent a day with him one time back in my radio days. I worked at the alternative rock station in town called Point. He came to town one year and hosted Point Fest. It was my job to drive him around that day while he was doing and making various appearances.

During this particular day of driving people around, did you get any soda sprayed on your car?

I did not. I think he hosted the Christmas show, not Point Fest. I did not get soda sprayed on me. That was Insane Clown Posse. I was getting him mixed up with someone. I did the same thing with Point Fest for Matt Penfield who was also very nice. It’s a stroll out on memory lane.

All that to say Cody is on that show.

Correct. You can go find that on Esquire Magazine’s website. It’s called In Transit. He interviews people in airport bars while they are in transit.

I see what he did there.

Hannah Frankson was on the Quotes by Christie podcast if you want to get more of her.

I didn’t listen to this, but I will say the name of this podcast drives me crazy.

Why is that?

Because it’s not a quote by Christie. It’s a quote by Hannah Frankson. It’s a quote by your guest, not you. Unless every guest is named Christie, that’s not going to work.

Christie Hannah Frankson. She had to legally change her name in order to appear on the podcast.

That’s quite a writer.

Speaking of podcasts, Alex Karwoski was on Tag Along With A Pro, which is his brother’s podcast.

Is this the brother that works for Hydrow or is this another brother? I think there’s a total of four children. Maybe there are four brothers and a sister.

You are the one who apparently is fixated on him. Not me.

He talks during his classes. This is how I learn about his family.

I don’t know. It’s called Tag Along With A Pro. It looks like they always talk to someone who works in the athletic world and you tag along with them. Hence the name.

You could see the family resemblance.

I wonder if he had to go through the press room.

That’s what I was wondering. Do they have to do the thing? I bet they had to do the thing.

Runner’s World is spotlighting women who have used running to help with their mental health. One of the women they spotlighted was Selena Samuela.

Well-deserved. I love this. I know she did a whole live on what shoes she does for different kinds of runs, so doubling down on the shoe thing.

It’s also nice that we’re seeing some instructors that don’t make the rounds as frequently.

I totally agree. It has been a lot of the same people over and over. It’s nice to see some of the other instructors get some love.


Emma Lovewell was the keynote speaker at Johnson & Johnson’s Global Activity Challenge. I’ve always wondered about Johnson and Johnson. Do you think that internally they had a fight over which Johnson was named first? Did they call it Johnson & Johnson so they didn’t have that fight? They both think that they were the ones that went first. If they’re both named Johnson, why didn’t they call the company Johnsons?

Maybe they like the name of it or the sound of it.

They could have done Johnsons’s and then put the apostrophe on the other side of s because it’s plural.

It would never be right. Nobody would ever do it.

People get it wrong half the time anyway. It would still be wrong half the time. It would just be wrong for different reasons. Anyway, Emma Lovewell was their keynote speaker at a thing. There you go.

Look at that. Another keynote speaker. These ladies are getting around. They’re doing the rounds.

Good for them.

Joining us from MetPro is Angelo, here to answer all of your fitness and nutrition questions.

Thanks for having me back.

We’re glad to have you back. Did it seem to you, Angelo, that Tom might have forgotten where you were from? It felt like he might have forgotten.

For just a second. He said that I was here to answer all your fitness questions, and I’m only here to answer most.

He’s here to answer every third fitness question.

Maybe every other fitness question.

What you don’t see is there’s a question and he’s like, “Here’s the thing.” He has an answer and he won’t give it to us. He’s like, “I’ve got a great solution for that problem but I’m not going to tell you.” It’s a complete power move. It’s peeling back the curtain.

That’s Angelo.

Tom is in rare form today.

He had a power nap before this. Lord, help us all.

I hope I can handle power nap talk.

I don’t do anything with power.

One of our listeners, Karen Marquez happens to be a MetPro user, just so you know.

You have to answer this one. It’s the law.

Karen says, “How do you know when you’re at your ideal weight? Is there such a thing?”

This is one of the ones I’m not going to answer. Is it okay to say this is a gender thing? I got so many guys that I’ve worked with over the years. Johnny’s like, “Angelo, I look good. I’m good here.” I’m like, “No, Johnny. You need to lose 50 pounds.” He’s like, “No, I’m good.” I’m like, “No, John. You need to lose 50 pounds.” I have guys and gals that are like, “I’m at the weight that I always wanted to be, but maybe I should be a couple of pounds lighter. Maybe I should be a couple of pounds heavier.” It’s not just one direction, but it’s that insatiable we are never satisfied bits.

There’s no right or wrong. Stay within healthy parameters. You know what I’m talking about when I say healthy parameters, but there is a threshold that I will speak to. That is you will cross a threshold where if you want to lose another 5 pounds, there’s nothing wrong with it. Be honest with yourself about what’s for health and what’s for preference, an aesthetic goal or a sporting goal. A lot of times, someone will say to me, “Don’t I need to lose another 5 pounds?” Not to be healthier, but if you want to lose another 5 pounds, let’s do it. As long as it’s not going to put you in an unhealthy weight, let’s do it.

Here’s what you’re going to have to do. That’s where the metabolic rate comes in. Do we have the leverage? If somebody says, “I want to lose another 5 pounds beyond where I’m at,” what your coach is going to do is they’re going to calculate where your metabolic rate is. They’re going to give you a no-nonsense answer and go, “No problem,” or “We can do that, but your metabolic rate means that we’re going to have to speed up your metabolism. You’re going to have to be strict for this period. Here’s what we’re looking for.”

It’s doable, but it’s a matter of listening to your own body. If somebody is asking, “Is there a magic BMI?” Throw that out the window. It’s not a thing anymore. That was based on the average American’s weight in I want to say ’50s, but don’t quote me on this.

If you’re going back to the ’50s, I’m going to have to go out on a limb and say it’s based on the average American White male’s weight.

Americans were simply smaller in the ‘50s. Statistically, we were smaller as people.

If you don’t believe it, go sit in a Broadway seat. They have not changed chairs there, and it’s a tight fit.

They had to start somewhere so they invented this BMI thing or Body Mass Index. What happens is you get a bunch of people that think they’re supposed to be this way. There are some people where it’s applicable to, but it’s not taking into consideration your genetic profile, your body type, and how much muscle you have on you. A simple, straight, healthy or unhealthy answer then doesn’t necessarily mean that’s true today.

It’s funny you say this. I listened to a whole podcast about the history of the BMI because I’m a nerd. They were saying too that the guy that invented it was like, “Don’t use this for people. Don’t use this for an individual person. This is for the aggregate. This isn’t designed for how do I, as one specific human being, measure up?” People were like, “But numbers.”

That’s what we do.

I need to give Karen something useful to walk away with. Karen, this is why people come and work with our MetPro coach. It’s because you need to have that conversation with him or her. Every single client of mine that I have ever worked with in the last two decades has asked me, you can put it on the calendar, “What should be my ideal weight?” They ask me that on day two, at the beginning,

I give them a real answer. I say, “That is a fair question. It is a good question. It deserves a real answer, which is why you’re going to ask me in about five weeks, then I’m going to be able to give you a real answer, having all this data on your metabolic rate, how you respond to caloric shifts, macronutrient changes, carbohydrates, exercise, the pace at which you’re losing weight, the pace at which we can speed your metabolism, and how fast we’ve lost said weight. Now, I can say, ‘Here’s an ideal weight for you. Let’s work towards that goal.’” Have that conversation with your coach, Karen. Have that conversation with him or her. She will help you out.

I’m curious. You talked about someone who reaches a weight. They’ve been doing it for a while. They’re in a good spot, but they decide that they maybe want to lose another 5 or 10 pounds, whether it’s for aesthetic reasons or they are trying to win a contest. If they’ve already hit a happy spot where they naturally land comfortably if they push through to lose that 5 or 10 pounds, how difficult and/or realistic is it for them to then maintain it if they hit that number?

Great question. It’s a commitment. It can absolutely be done. In fact, quite often, clients will come to us specifically at that point. They’ve already been on either a diet or a program. They’ve been exercising and they’ve made great progress, but now they’re at the point where they need some professional help to get that last percent or two, or that last few pounds.

That’s where math and science play a role. That’s where the evaluation piece comes in. Assuming someone is at that spot where they’ve already been eating clean, they’re exercising regularly, and their body is at a healthy but comfortable body weight, then it’s not as hard as you’d think to push down a little lighter. That can be done with some leverage. The key is that when you hit that lighter weight, it’s not yours yet.

You have to earn it.

For example, “I want to be 150 pounds. I’m 157 and I want to be 150.” I’m pulling numbers out of a hat here. We put you on a diet to be 150. Three weeks later, “I’m 150.” Nope. You don’t own that weight yet. It’s going to take you another four weeks longer of being consistent to own that weight. Here’s what’s happened. We’ve had to push harder to put your body into an environment and circumstance where it has forced them down a few more pounds.

Now, you have to gradually increase your intake in a calculated fashion to up adjust your metabolism so you don’t gain that weight back. Otherwise, the first bad weekend you have, and you’re right back to your comfortable weight. Sometimes we refer to that as a set point. Typically, when somebody asks me, “How long will it take? I want to lose another 5 pounds.” Losing the next 5 pounds may only take 10 days, but it may take me 2 to 3 weeks beyond that to reset your metabolism so you stay there at that new lower weight. That’s what we do day in and day out with our clients at MetPro. That was a great question, Tom.

I’m sorry. I will try not to do it again. I’ve got a rep to protect. Thank you so much for all that. Until next time, if people want this sort of stuff tailor-made for them, where can they find you?

Thank you.

There was a surprise guest in the studio, LP Giobbi.

What I do know is that she’s a DJ.

It should be DJ Giobbi.

She was in a class with Emma Lovewell. It was a 45-minute arms and intervals ride. She took the class with Emma and then in one of her classes, All In A Dream, which was featuring a whole bunch of people, was featured during the playlist. A nice little stop-in. There was a whole bunch of stuff on Peloton Studio. She did some little dances in front of everybody. I think that’s required if you’re a DJ.

The next time somebody tells you that Peloton is in the toilet, you should shove a Mirror in their face. Not a real mirror but those things that Lululemon keeps trying to sell people. They can’t give those things away.

It’s pretty bad.

This is from Channel News and it says, “They can’t sell these things despite a 90% markdown.”

Remember they’re trying to sell, and they can’t sell the company.

They said they currently have it valued on their books at $58 million, and in 2020, they paid $500 million for it.

That’s got to make you have some stomach acid.

Have they changed CEOs? I feel like maybe they should.

Lululemon makes so much money. This is still this tiny little drop in the bucket, but it’s not great.

Buy two pair of leggings and get a Mirror. They’re getting close.

It also says that nobody is going to be doing any sales of big companies right now. That’s what the article is indicating. It’s not a good time to be selling a company.

Here’s my favorite quote from the article from one fitness insider, “The reality is that the Mirror is just a larger screen than your iPhone or iPad. You don’t need a special Mirror. You could literally lean your phone against the Mirror and do a workout video or FaceTime a trainer.”

Tom, were you quoted in this?

Do you mean what I’ve been saying for four years?

I think this fitness Insider is listening to us.

They have to be listening because no one would ever refer to me as a fitness insider. I’ve been saying this for years. It’s just a giant TV that they’re hanging sideways.

You said it since the very first time you heard about it. You kept saying, “I don’t get it.”

It’s just a sideways TV. It’s all it is. It was always a dumb idea. For a moment there, connected fitness was so hot that you could sell people anything.

A lot of people thought that Mirror was Tonal. Don’t forget that.

That’s the sad thing. I think Mirror hurts Tonal.

It’s so frustrating. Tonal is the best strength product on the market. I don’t care what anybody says. All those competitors out there have copied Tonal. They all try so hard to be Tonal. They’ve got giant footprints compared to Tonal. Tonal is the best strength product and has amazing instructors.

What Tonal does is not what Mirror does at all. When you see the screen hanging on your wall, people think it’s the same thing but it’s a third of the price. It is not the same thing.

This is the face I give when people come to our house going, “Is that one of those Mirror things?”

“You need to leave now.”

“You’re not welcome here.”

“It’s time for you to go.” I think people get confused. If they don’t drill down on it, they see a Tonal and they’re like, “Why would I pay that much more for something I can do with the Mirror?” Because what you’re doing with the Tonal is not in any way, shape, or form like what you’re going to do with the Mirror.

That’s true.

Apple reportedly has unannounced fitness features in the works for Vision Pro.

I’m excited about this.

Is that their VR thing?

That’s their VR thing. I’m curious about this. Apple, if you want me to go ahead and try it out, I would be happy to do that.

I’m sure they will get right on it.

I’m excited to see what they’re going to do because there’s a lot that’s going to happen with VR and fitness. This is just getting started. It’s going to be the next connected fitness wave, I believe.

All I can think is I have trouble getting the headphones to stay in. These things you strap into your head better stay in place if you want people to exercise while wearing them.

That’s true. I have also heard that the Apple One has done a lot for comfort. They’ve put a lot of effort into that. I don’t know. I haven’t tried it.

We shall see.

It’s just what I’m hearing.

When we’ve played Brian’s, it’s very big and bulky and I can’t imagine trying to get up and down.

I want to play some Beat Saber. Set that up.

I’d love to have him set it up before he goes off to college. We will never be able to figure it out. Tempo is apparently still around. They have a new take on AI personal training. They’ve added 3D body scans and dynamic reps. I don’t know why they would ever think I would find a 3D scan of my body a selling point. The last thing I need is to get a close-up look at myself in 3D.

Not everybody wants to. The idea is that over time, as your body composition changes, you can see those changes with the scan. That’s the idea of it. If you had this for Tonal, I think you’d love it because you would’ve seen major changes happen over time. I have a little bone to pick with this word dynamic reps that they’re putting in here.

Dynamic modes on Tonal mean they do things like on the down stroke or the eccentric mode, it pulls down harder. They also have one that’s like chains mode. As you go up, like with bicep curls, it makes it harder. When they say dynamic and they’re adding a rest period in, that’s not very dynamic in my opinion.

I rest just fine.

You got to rest when you want to rest.

I rested right before we started recording and made you crabby.

It must be nice. I don’t know. It’s interesting.

When it comes to exercise, I can tell you this. I got the rest part down. I’m good at the rest part.

You’ve mentioned rest a lot in this episode.

I took a rest day for the first 50 years of my life.

You were an expert rester.

I am good at that. Are there any resting influencers? I could be one of those. I would like to be a resting influencer.

Keep your treadmill routines exciting and interesting by mixing it up with the weight variety. Share on X

That could be a fun account.

That seems silly.

I don’t know. I thought I’d mention it. I wasn’t too impressed with it, but we will see.

That’s Tempo’s brand, not impressing you.

For a lot of people, this is the best thing for them because they can’t slap a Tonal on their wall for whatever reason. At least, they’re still able to get some good strength training.

This is the one where you lean against the wall.

Sometimes it has a little cabinet or sometimes it’s the one that the Tempo move or whatever. It’s a tiny little screen. You put your phone up there and it does the rest. I don’t know. It’s super tiny. While we’re talking about competitors, I want to remind everyone that I was able to host a Tonal Talk.

We didn’t.

That was me.

They made it very clear, “Not Tom.”

They didn’t say that. I was honored to host the Tonal Talk. It was the first time that Krystal Zell, the new CEO of Tonal, has been interviewed publicly. People were able to pre-submit their questions. It was cool to have somebody at that level take the time to address things that needed to be addressed. It has been weird ever since the LA coaches were let go. It was nice that they addressed that. Apparently, it’s not good enough for some people, but whatever. I thought that it was great that they took all these pre-submitted questions. I was most impressed with the fact that they did not weed out any questions.

They answered every one of them.

There were some tough questions in there. If you are curious about where Tonal is headed and would like to hear more, that entire recording is over on Facebook at the Official Tonal Community. You can find it there.

We would like to issue a public service announcement to remind people that the studio will be closed on July 3rd and 4th. Just the New York studio.

No, it’s everybody because they’re not doing any classes those days. There are no live classes those days. All encore.

I love the fact that they’re making the London Studio celebrate July 4th. That feels a little harsh. Too soon, Peloton. We revolted against you and now we’re making you take the day off to celebrate it.

You’re funny.

We have new dance cardio classes. I did dance cardio by accident once on the Tonal.

You were not pleased.

I was not a fan.

I did this once on Peloton with Brian and it was awful. I had fun but it is not for me.

It made me mad. I couldn’t keep up with whatever the move was.

It doesn’t matter how simple it is. It doesn’t matter how much they slow it down. I can’t do it.

I’m sure if you like the dance, these are great.

For sure. People do love them. It’s great that they’re still putting out new classes once a year. That’s cool. There are eight new ones and we’ve got Leanne Hainsby, Emma Lovewell, and Hannah Corbin.

We have new scenic classes for people. We don’t, but Peloton does.

It’s going to be featuring Jeffrey and Rebecca Kennedy. Those are going to be dropping on Friday, June 30th. As well as all the other things we already talked about like dance cardio. I think we already told you about the Pride stuff that was going to be happening on June 30th as well.

Also, a German artist series.

Yeah, Cher. That’s so weird because we’ve done Cher a long time ago.

I guess the Germans haven’t.

Also, there are new plans coming from the gym feature. If you like using the gym feature, there’s a whole bunch of new plans dropping as well. There are lots of new stuff hitting very soon.

Coming up after this, we’re going to talk to Scott Jenkins. He’s a big runner.

Long distance like an ultra runner.

He was probably running the whole time we were talking to him. He’s never not running.

I love our conversation about air conditioning.

He’s going to explain why they don’t need it over there. Stick around and check that out.

Joining us is Scott Jenkins. Scott, how is it going?

It’s going well. It’s a pleasure to meet you and Crystal. Thank you so much for having me on the show. It’s a pleasure to be here.

Thank you for being here. I always like to find out where people started their Peloton journey. I know you’ve been active for a long time and have done a lot of things. When did Peloton specifically come into your life?

It came into my life probably before lockdown. I would say 2019. My wife, Abby, was like, “We should get a bike. Let’s give it a go.” I’ve always dabbled with cycling. I somewhat enjoyed it. I go for phases where I quite enjoy it or quite don’t enjoy it. I decided, “Why not? Let’s give it a go.” I was surprised by the build quality of it. I always thought, “The screen is great. The classes are great.” Especially on the treads, I like the guided runs. Also, I like the scenic runs. I do a lot of those. That’s where my journey started. Subsequently, I went on to get to try those.

I was very fortunate. I managed to somehow blag Peloton that if they would let me buy the tread early when it was released in the UK, I would post about it. They very kindly let me. I was blown away by how good it is. To be fair, the treadmill is fantastic. I’ve had it for coming up to three years. I’ve never had to service it and never had a problem with it. It runs. I probably should get it serviced before the lease runs out to be fair, but it’s a great bit of a kit.

I have the Tread+. It has never been available in the UK. Nobody can take it from me.

That was a little humble brag right there like, “It has never been available in the UK.”

It has never been available like air conditioning. For some reason, we don’t have air conditioning. We were talking about this before we came on.

We were talking about how Americans are whiny little b*tches. Those are my words, not his. I said that.

I’m taking fifth. Is that what they say?

You can’t take the fifth. That’s an American thing.

That’s our thing. You can’t take the fifth.

This is an American show. I can do what I want.

You are going to make a fine American.

Thank you.

That says so much about how insidious American pop culture is. You could instantly know what our pledge of allegiance is. I don’t even know if you guys have one.

I don’t know if we have one or not. Maybe God Save the King. I don’t know. Maybe something like that.

That’s got to be a weird thing to start saying, “God Save the King,” instead of Queen. That would have to be a weird shift after all these years.

It’s something that I thought about for the very first time. I was watching the FA Cup Finals. The FA Cup is very similar to the Premier League. It’s the same teams where they compete in this cup competition. You can play teams from the lower divisions and so on and so forth. In the end, they have the final in Wembley Stadium. It’s a little bit like a mini Super Bowl situation. They all sing the national anthem. That was the first time I’ve seen it properly sung at a big event like that where they changed the words to God save the King. It does make you think a little bit, doesn’t it? You got to think that the singers have got to get that right as well and don’t mess that one up.

They have been doing it their entire lives. There are very few people that probably remember a time when there was a king.

Do you think they all had sticky notes in front of them?

They put it on the big screen there. We’re massively advanced apart from when it comes to air conditioning.

All I can think about is how much trouble I had, especially at first when we started this show by not saying Reel Spoilers.

That’s his other podcast.

I still slip up, every once in a while. I’ve done it over there and said The Clip Out instead of Reel Spoilers. It takes a minute.

We talked about national anthems and things like that. I’m sure you do this as well. You go onto YouTube sometimes and watch stuff. You go down a wormhole. I like the country singer Chris Stapleton.

We’ve seen him. He’s good.

I’d love to see him live. I love the song Tennessee Whiskey. I saw him on a YouTube clip singing the United States Star Spangled Banner anthem before the Super Bowl in 2023. I’m not from there, but I had goosebumps listening to him sing. That guy is unbelievable. That was probably one of the best renditions of your anthem I’ve ever seen.

His voice has this yearning that matches the national anthem. It’s that soulfulness that comes with it. He has an amazing voice.

We were lucky enough to see him right as he was blowing up. He was playing a theater in town that seats about 4,000 people, which he would never play someplace that small anymore. We saw it.

That’s cool. What was he like live? I’m intrigued by him.

He was great. He sounds every bit as good as the record. There is no trickery going on there.

He’s so chill. He’s not running around the stage. He’s like, “I will stand here and have my amazing voice talk for me,” and that’s it. It’s just him and the show. I don’t mean that it’s not full of energy. It’s this quiet energy. It’s cool. It’s neat.

When you got a voice that good, you don’t need to do anything else.

That’s true. It’s fascinating the way some artists run all over the stage and some stand there. The true superstars, even if they stand there for some reason, they still hold you in a way that somebody with less charisma could run all over the place and you’re like, “Whatever.”

People have a presence.

They are captivating. Another YouTube clip I saw was Ed Sheeran and Luke Combs singing together. I was like, “That’s a cool combo.” I’d like to see Ed Sheeran and Chris Stapleton together. They did a song a couple of years back. It’s very cool.

We saw Luke Combs too because I booked him. I book concerts for a living, and I booked a Luke Combs show.

That’s awesome. Can you book me Chris Stapleton, please?

I got Luke Combs. I got lucky. I booked him nine months before he blew up. By the time he played my arena, he had no business playing my arena. He should have been in a place twice the size. It’s called a mid-sized arena. On a show like that, it’ll sit about 7,500.

That’s so cool. I’d love to see Luke Combs too.

If you ever make it Stateside, we’ll do our best to hook you up.

Hook me up with Luke Combs and maybe some air conditioner at the concert.

You will need it here.

You mentioned that you have a relationship with bikes, but when did you start running? That’s been a big thing in your life, right?

Yeah, it always has been. When I was younger, I did running in high school. I thought 1,500 meters was quite a long way to run. As you get older, you learn different perspectives and different boundaries. I went to play football or soccer as you guys call it. I was doing that up until the age of 30, and then I rediscovered running. I got back into it and did a couple of half-marathons.

About that time, I was working in a gym in South Wales where I’m from. This guy used to come in, this guy called Colin. He was the most positive guy. He would be chucking it down with rain, which is why we don’t need the air conditioning. He’d be chucking it down with rain. Ultimately, he would always be so positive.

The one day he came in, I was like, “I’ve got to ask you. Why are you so positive? Every time I see you, you always got a smile on your face.” He said, “I’ve been through a cardiac event.” He’d had a triple bypass. He said to me, “I feel like I’ve got a second chance at life.” It didn’t hit me immediately. I was like “That’s fair enough.” Over the course of the next couple of weeks, it got me thinking, “What am I doing with my own life that when I get to that kind of age where you get older that you’re going to look back on with some fondness and think, “I did a bit.” Ultimately, I went from 0 to 100 is the long story short.

I and my brother ended up again on a plane to run 2,000 miles across the US with our friend, Rusty, from Texas. We ran from Boston in Massachusetts to Austin in Texas. We did a marathon a day for 75 days. It’s still one of the biggest challenges I’ve ever done, but so exciting too. It was a great way to see your country, which is how I’ve ended up visiting about 44 states over the years. That’s my relationship with how running started, and then it’s gone on into different ultra-marathons and lots of different adventures over the years.

75 in 75 days. Was the hardest one the last one? Was it the second to last one? Not even physically difficult, although I’m sure it was, but psychologically, I would think at some point, how do you not hit a wall in your head?

You hit many walls on a daily basis, and they come in different forms. It’s interesting. Probably the first two weeks were the hardest because you put yourself out there. Granted, social media wasn’t as big then as it is now. You put yourself out there and say, “I’m doing this run for charity,” and I always do my runs for charity. I realized at that point, “We’re two weeks in. I’m committed. I haven’t got a flight until I get back to Texas, so we got to do this thing.” My body was breaking down. My Achilles hurt. My knees hurt. Everything hurt.

After about that two-week period, strangely, it became like, “This is what your body is meant to do.” When you think about it, and I’m a bit older and I reflect on it, that’s what we were designed to do. We weren’t designed to sit at a desk all day to waste away or sit in our cars. I generally believe that somewhere along the way, humans have mistaken comfort for happiness. Going out and having an adventure like that is a visceral experience.

For me, those two weeks were difficult. After that, there were many different challenges along the way, but the body held up. The most painful thing on a daily occurrence was the Achilles tendons when you get out of bed every morning. There was no elasticity. There was looseness in them, I suppose. They would always be stiff and always be hurting, but once you start moving a little bit, they’d loosen up. Taking it day-by-day, half marathon by half marathon throughout the day, so to speak, we managed to get it done. We learned a lot along the way, to say the least.

Were there 75 official marathons you could run, or on some days, you have to go out and be like, “We’re running one, the two of us,” or however many people were in your group?

It was three of us. It was my brother, Reese, our friend, Rusty, and myself. This was what iPhone 2 or iPhone 1 or whatever it was. We had Google Maps on it. We went to a bar in Boston. It was called McGreevy’s then. We said, “We’re going to start here. It’s a pub. We’re British.”

You found a pub that was 26.2 miles away.

That’s it. I would probably go back and do exactly that. We found 26.2 miles away and went to the nearest town. We didn’t know where we were going to stay and where our meals were coming from. We’d go into town and tell a motel or two, “We’re doing this run across the states. Is there any chance you could put us up for the night or give us a discount for a night?”

The wonderful thing for me was there were so many cool people we met along the way that were complete strangers that wanted to help us out of kindness, whether that was giving us a meal or making a donation to charity. We slept on the floor of a Baptist church in Tennessee one night. We have loads of little stories like that. It was a great experience and a great way to see your country as well.

Did you train for this at all or were you like, “Let’s do this.”

I did train for it, but we didn’t know what we were getting ourselves into. I’m not sure anyone truly does until you start something like that. We had jobs. We were working and trying to train outside of that. I can tell you after the 3rd or 4th marathon in a row, you certainly realize the reality of the situation there and then.

It does boggle the mind of all the things that could go wrong. You’re traveling in all kinds of different weather. You’re traveling in all kinds of different terrain. You’re traveling parts that have mountains, that are hilly, or flat in different weather conditions. I can’t even imagine how you did that day after day. That sounds tough.

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I was going to say awful. That was the adlib in my head. It sounds awful.

It was 50% tough and 50% crazy probably. In Maslow’s hierarchy of needs, you’re on the bottom level. All you care about is not dying, having something to eat, and having somewhere to sleep. It would help to know that you had a hotel room for the night already sorted during the day or that you knew what you were going to have for dinner. We were young. We didn’t have loads of money. We were just trying to figure it out on the fly.

The most dangerous things on a daily occurrence were the traffic. You don’t expect to see many people running down the road in the middle of nowhere in Pennsylvania, Ohio, or wherever it is. The dogs in Kentucky are not the most friendly bunch of dogs I’ve ever met in Kentucky. The people there were lovely, but it seemed to be that every house liked to have a dog that they would let roam around the land. You’d run past and it would never be like, “Look at that nice French bulldog,” or “Look at that nice pug.” It would always be like, “Look at that nice Rottweiler. It can take my leg off.” It was that kind of scenario. It certainly made you run quicker though.

One of the questions here is when did you start ultramarathons? From the sounds of it, I’m going to say day six.

Pretty much. I suppose it was around about 2012 or something like that when I started doing 50Ks or 30-milers and things like that. I moved roles. I moved into working in orthopedics for Johnson & Johnson. When you work in a corporation like that, your annual leave, you want to make the most of it. I still wanted to make sure that I was using my annual leave to do good so that when I’m older in life and look back, I’d think I had an adventure but I did some good along the way.

That’s what I wanted to look back on and it still is. I want to look back and go, “I had an event with my friends, my family, and my colleagues, and I did some good at the same time.” From there, I and my brother went and cycled from Turin in Italy to Cardiff in Wales, which is 1,000 miles. We got into ultra-running and did a run across Death Valley in California in July, which was rather warm. We did that twice for charity. We ran across Iceland. We were creating our own unique events and challenges. I started learning about these 100 and 200-mile distance races, or 250-mile distances even. I found myself towing the start line of these crazy races all over the world and I love it.

You said that you do this for charity. You always run for charity. Do you have one charity that you focus on or do you spread it around? How do you do that?

I do. Thank you so much for asking. I appreciate it. I support a charity called Operation Smile. Operation Smile performs surgical intervention for children with cleft lips and cleft palates all around the world. When I did my fundraising run back in 2015 and 2016 in Death Valley, I raised money for Operation Smile.

They had this great video and a great mark. It was Operation Smile but coupled with a Coldplay song. You know the Coldplay song, getting by the heartstrings every time. I was like, “I’m sold on what this charity does.” Later that year, they very kindly sent me to a program in Ethiopia in a small town called Mekelle down in Ethiopia. I got to see firsthand the work that they do and how it changed people’s lives. For the cost of £150 or $180, something like that, you can perform surgery that gives somebody the opportunity to smile. It’s a great number and a great fact. You know every time you raise that, you’ve changed someone’s life, hopefully. That’s why I support this great charity.

It also gives you insight into what the markup is here. I know you have socialized medicine, but there’s still an expense associated with it. It’s probably $20,000 or $30,000. That’s crazy.

I had the pleasure and honor of meeting the founder of the charity, Dr. Bill Magee, and his wife, Kathy Magee, in New Jersey. I was listening to him talk. He never realized the size of the problem until he went to the Philippines. When he was out there, he was helping some local hospitals perform surgery. People realized that he could do cleft surgery, so all of a sudden, they were overwhelmed by thousands of people end up in this one hospital. He thought, “I need to start a charity to support this and keep going back.” That’s how the charity started.

That’s amazing. Is there anything the Peloton community can do to support you? Do you have a link or something that people can go to?

That’s amazing. Thank you again for asking. I am running The Triple Crown of 200 milers this summer in the United States. The Triple Crown of 200s, for people who don’t know, are free 200-mile races that are nonstop. Once you start, you’re on the clock. It’s up to you if you decide to rest or take a break, or whatever it might be. That is the Tahoe 200 on the 21st of July 2023, Tahoe 200. Bigfoot 200 is on the 11th of August 2023. I’ve got less than two weeks to be able to recover to run another 200-mile race. The reason for that was there was so much snow in Tahoe in 2023. It hasn’t melted. All the bears are pissed off. They’ve brought the races closer together. The third one of them is the Moab 240 in Utah in October 2023. I’ve got a fundraising page link which is on my Instagram bio. Is that what they call it these days? It takes you to my fundraising page. If you don’t mind, my Instagram is @ScottJJenkins if anyone wants to check it out.

That’s wonderful. You have a Peloton tread. You mentioned that. You clearly use it a lot. There are a lot of people that are elite runners that scoff at using treadmills to train for such long distances. I’m curious about your thoughts on that.

Firstly, I don’t classify myself anything as such as elite.

I don’t know. Anybody that runs 600 miles in summer, I’m going to go ahead and count that, but you do you.

Thank you. I like the treads. The reason why is that I live in London. As you can imagine, it’s fairly flat around here. There’s not much elevation. Certainly, in the Midwest, it is fairly similar to where you guys are from. There are not many mountains around here. What I will do is I’ll use the incline a lot on the treads. I’ll use the scenic runs or I jump into a class. I have a bit of flexibility in my training that otherwise, I couldn’t get. I can go on the tread for an hour and get over 1,000 feet of elevation. For me to do that around here would take me so much longer because there are simply not enough hills. Also, I would end up running the same hill back and forth. This makes it more interesting.

The second thing is a little bit more sadistic in a way, I suppose. If you run on the treadmill a lot, you don’t get the excitement of running on the trail. If you think about that for a second, I am six weeks out from Tahoe 200. I’ve been on the trail a little bit, but the weather, unsurprisingly, has been chucking it down with rain for most of the year so far in London. The weather has been terrible. There are muddy trails. On the treadmill, you can get quality miles.

Also, when it comes to running the Tahoe 200, I’m going to be so excited because I’m outside. I’m in the mountains. I’ve got this beautiful scenery. That will motivate me. It’s almost where you’ve had a little bit of sensory deprivation in a way. I’ve done something else, which is probably another level of sadism. It’s not that I’m into that stuff, but it was my wife’s suggestion. I’m not sure if she’s trying to kill me again or not. The heating tiles that you can get from Bikram Yoga, you can buy those off the internet. I bought two of those and installed them over the treadmill in the gym. I can heat the treadmill up to about 60 degrees Celsius, which is well over 120 Fahrenheit. It may even be 130. The hottest I’ve ever had was 52. I did an hour. I can tell you it was pretty horrible, to say the least.

I’m sweating just listening to that.

Come to London. Come and have a run. You’ll love it.

We’re Americans. We have air conditioning.

To clarify, there is no air conditioning.

How long does it take for the room to cool back down?

That’s what I was going to say. You put these heat tiles on. You’re making the whole house miserable when you do that, right?

It’s in the garage. I turned the garage into a gym.

Circling back around in the beginning, you were talking about how you’ve had your tread for so long and that you haven’t had to have it serviced that it’s still doing great. Hearing how much you run puts that endorsement in a different stratosphere. You’re not somebody that’s running 3 or 4 miles a week on your tread. You’re putting hundreds of miles a week probably at least a month on your tread.

On the tread, I’m probably averaging about 30 miles a week. The rest are outdoors. In the winter, it’s higher. Not only that, I was a little bit cautious about putting the heaters on at first because I’m like, “Is that going to fry the insides of it?” It didn’t bother it, not one bit. It’s a wicked endorsement of that product.

When it comes to your classes, I know earlier, you said you do a lot of scenic classes. When you take classes, do you know in your mind, “This is what I’m going to do today. I’m going to do this many miles at this speed,” or, “I’m going to add in all hills,” or whatever, or do you follow the instructor?

This is something that I struggle with. Sometimes, I jump on. My friend, Susie Chan, and you probably know Susie, is a Peloton instructor.

I love Susie. She is one of my favorite instructors. I love her so much.

She’s an absolute legend. What she’s like on the Peloton screen is exactly what she’s like in real life as well. She is such a great runner and a great person too. She has a great personality to a very vibrant and happy person. I do sometimes struggle because I’ll do a class and then I’m like, “Do I follow the instructor or do I follow my training program?”

Sometimes, you get carried away with the music and you’re like, “I’m following the instructor.” I’m then like, “I didn’t do what was on my plan.” That’s why I end up jumping back to the scenic runs. I was thinking of this as well. The US is such a beautiful country. The scenery you have and the diversity of it is amazing. It’s only when you stop and think about it. In all the many national parks that you’ve got, when you see them on the tread screen, you’re like, “I’d love to visit some of these places one day.

We try to get to a lot of different places. We like to travel in general, but we have never been to Europe. That’s one place where there’s a lot there that we want to do.

You need to come to London. Anytime, you’re welcome.

I would love to. It’s so hard to get places. When you live in the middle of the United States, when you go on a flight, it’s like eight million flights before you get to where you want to go.

We live in St. Louis. St. Louis isn’t a major hub anymore as it was when I was a kid. To go internationally, it is always at least 2 flights, sometimes 3.

It takes a lot of time to get over there. You know all about it because you come the other way. You said you run about 30 miles on your tread during this time of year and the rest are outdoors. How many miles are you running? When you’re ramping up to something like a 200-mile run, how many miles a week total are you doing?

At the moment, I’m probably on about 60 miles a week. It will get to about 80 or 90 in the next two weeks or so, and then it will come down a little bit. I’ve got one weekend coming up which has got a 30-mile a day and then a 30-mile a day the day after. I toyed with doing the 62-miler on one day and then taking the Sunday to have a beer, chill out, and have a barbecue.

My coach was like “I want you to do the 30 miles on Saturday and 30 miles on Sunday.” He thinks that it’ll be a better response for me to get the rest in, be able to go the next day again, and then be able to continue high-quality training throughout the week. If I did the 100K on its own or the 62 miles on its own, it might take me two weeks to recover from that. I’m not going to do that. I’m coached by a great guy called Jeff Brown who’s from Flagstaff down in Arizona. He’s taught me a lot of cool stuff. A lot of the workouts that I do on the treadmill or outdoors are all created by him. He always keeps it interesting, for sure.

Does he train you from Flagstaff or does he live in London?

He trains me from Flagstaff. It’s cool. We get on well. You call us veteran runners. I’ve got a bit of gray hair going on.

Do you just run or do you do any strength training or anything like that?

I do tons of strength training as well. I love it. I’ve got weight racks up in the same gym with the treadmill. To be honest, it was a ramshackle garage that we’ve added bits to. The first bit of a kit was the tread and then started adding different bits and weights into it. I do some cool workouts there that are different but also try to replicate some of the conditions that you’ll face in the mountains. Those are things like stepping up onto a big box, wearing a weighted vest, and power hiking on the treadmill as well. I do a bit of that. I do loads of different things. It gives me good variety in my workouts. You need that when you’re doing a bit on the treadmill or quite a bit on the treadmill, and mixing it up with the weights. Variety keeps it interesting, I suppose.

Do you have a day job that you do in addition to all these things? I don’t know if you have time to do all this training.

Where do you find the time?

My 9:00 to 5:00 is that I work for Johnson & Johnson in orthopedics. The ironic part of that is that I specialize in hip and knee replacement.

He gets a discount.

I see what my future looks like.

When I hear 75 marathons in 75 days, when I hear ultramarathon, when I hear like, “Maybe I’ll do 60 today so I can take the day off,” I’m surprised you don’t work for Johnson & Johnson & Johnson.

I seriously don’t know. I know you said you worked for Johnson & Johnson earlier, but I assumed you didn’t anymore. I don’t know how you have time to train.

It’s good planning. I don’t beat myself up. If I miss a session, I just go back and try and pick it up on the weekend. My coach knows that my job for a large corporate like J&J is pretty intense and full-on. I make sure that I get my long runs in on the weekend. During the week, I have a run first thing in the morning before work, or in the evening, I do my strength and conditioning. If I have got a bit of a long run during the week, I’ll split it. Maybe in the morning, I’ll do a couple of miles on the treadmill, and then in the evening, go and get them out on the road or in the local park or something like that.

It’s good planning and making sure that I got to pay the bills first and do the day job first, which I love as well. It’s a nice balance because I feel like I’ve learned so much from ultra-running that I’ve been able to bring into the business and probably vice versa in terms of planning for races and stuff from a business perspective. I am applying spreadsheets to my training and also my kit and stuff like that.

The easiest way to give a parallel between the two is if you’re doing an ultramarathon, a 100-mile or a 200-mile there, it’s a massive goal. You’ve got to break it down into bite-sized chunks. Along the way, you know there are going to be ups and there are going to be downs. The key to finishing that race is making sure you don’t get too carried away with the ups and too despondent with the downs. Keep it on a level. Get back up and keep moving forward when the obstacles hit you.

When you think about a sales process, and I manage a sales team of ten people in the city of London, which is competitive, it’s the same thing. You’ve got a big account goal. You want to win an account. It may take two years. You’ve got all these things to do. You’ve got to train surgeons. You’ve got to review clinical literature. You’ve got to get the prices right and all these things. There are going to be obstacles and ups and downs along the way. That’s similar to ultra-running the way. The ultra-running has taught me patience to put problems into perspective to reach a positive outcome in both, I suppose.

I am interested that it’s B2B sales. When I was like, “How hard is it to sell a hip to a guy who doesn’t have a hip?”

It is like, “I can see you can’t walk. Would you like a new hip?”

It is like, “I see you lying on the ground there. I was thinking I could interest you in a hip replacement.”

It is like, “Would you be interested if you know it’s going to cost you $30,000?”

I’ve heard amazing things about the new hip ones. I can’t remember what material they’re made out of, but we had somebody on not too long ago that had one. They were so excited about the new material and how great it was.

It’s amazing. The outcomes for hip patients are phenomenal. They call it the silent hip because patients have their hips replaced and they forget that they’ve been done. It’s a ball and socket joint. Once it’s done, you get a ceramic on ceramic or metal on polyethylene bearing. Patients do well. Knee arthroplasty is getting to the same place as well, which is exciting. The other set forward is we are starting to see digital robotics in surgery as well, which is fascinating. That’s the next frontier for orthopedic surgery.

I have one more question about your training though on your schedule. How many hours a week are we talking about that you’re training? I’m a slow runner.

You running 30 miles would be 9 hours. Her running 30 hours is probably 2.5.

That’s why I want to put it in perspective.

I wish. I reckon I do probably an hour a day on average of strength and conditioning. I do it pretty much every day because I enjoy it. Even when I go into the treadmill sessions, I’m like, “I’ll do a few weights while I’m here.” The running depends on what’s on my plan. I did 15 miles. I had to drive an hour down to what we call the Surrey Hills. There are some hills out there that you can run up and down, which is great. I did 15 miles there. That was another three hours because there is a lot of elevation. It’s all on-trail or off-trail kind of stuff. I did 10, and then during the week, I’ve got the other miles in as well. It’s hard to say, but I execute whatever is in my plan distance-wise.

It’s like, “Don’t think about it. You just do it.”

It’s like what we talked about a minute ago. You’ve got those obstacles along the way and those challenges to overcome. It’s a little bit like that with the training side of things. After a while, you’ve run every route that you can possibly think of, so how do you stop yourself from getting bored? You got to put things into perspective, execute the plan, and keep moving forward.

What is your leaderboard name?

It is ScottJJenkins. It’s the same as Instagram. It’s original.

It’s called consistent branding. We go with that.

That’s exactly what I was thinking. Consistent branding and marketing are wonderful.

Do you have a preferred instructor?

I’ve got to say Susie Chan. She’s my favorite mate.

That’s understandable.

Crystal is a big fan as well.

I am a huge fan of Susie. I love her so much. I hope someday to get to meet her. She’s amazing.

I hope you do too. I hope you can come over and meet her and maybe do one of her classes. I was lucky enough to go a month ago to her New Wave class, which is so cool. It was all ‘80s songs. I’m an ‘80s child, so I was loving it. You guys have got to come over and check it out. It’s so cool.

It’s always been a dream of mine to sit in the lobby of the London studio.

He doesn’t do any workouts for Peloton at all. He does not run, but he does strength training. That’s all he does.

What about the rower? The rower is out over there.

He won’t do it.

We’re still waiting on the rower to arrive in the UK. That’ll be exciting.

I hope that happens this 2023. I hope it happens pretty soon. I feel like it’s going to happen pretty soon based on everything.

I was over to talk at a US running show in Boston back in February 2023. We went out for a drink the night before to have 1 or 2, but my wife’s from Scotland so 1 or 2 is maybe slightly more than that. As we were walking our way back through the mall, we saw the Peloton store. They had the rower shining into the window. I was like, “You should go and try it.” She was like, “That will be a great idea. I’ll go and try it.”

She’s a couple of drinks deep and gets on the rower. I’m like, “Can you set her up with 1,000 meters here? I want to see how quickly she can do it.” The guy was like, “Sure, no problem.” She gets into it and she’s like, “I’m knocked out. You’re going to need to take over.” I’m like, “Not a chance.” We have test rode the rower and it is quite good, to be fair. It looks good.

I love it. It’s gorgeous. I hope you guys get it pretty soon. It will sell well.

I have one cool little story about the drinks part. When I got invited to talk at the Run Show in Boston, I knew that that’s where we started the 2,000-mile run. I went over. It was only for three days. I thought, “I wonder if that bar is still there that we went to 10 or 11 years ago.” It was. The cool thing was it was right across the street from the place where I was talking at the Run Show USA. We went across. That’s why we went and had a couple of beers.

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The nice thing about it is that if you told me years earlier, “One day, you’ll be across the street at Hynes Convention Center talking at the Run Show,” I would never have believed you. The only way that I’ve been able to accomplish that is through getting out there and trying to push myself to have an adventure and do some good.

That’s amazing. Do you still run with your brother? In all these adventures, do you still do all that stuff with your brother?

We try to. We both applied to Badwater this 2023. We didn’t get in, unfortunately, but we’d love to do that race together one year. It would be cool. My brother still lives in Wales, so I don’t get to run with him that often. When I do, it’s nice and special. You don’t see many siblings going out and running 100 miles or 2,000 miles together somewhere.

On that note, thank you so much for taking time out of your day to talk to us. This has been a lot of fun.

Thank you so much.

It’s been amazing. It’s been good to meet you guys. I’m so grateful for you having me on and asking these questions. I appreciate it.

We appreciate you and all the good you’ve done and all the money you’ve raised over the years. Thank you for all that you’re doing. That’s cool. It’s inspiring to a lot of people. Thank you for taking the time to share it.

Thank you. That’s kind of you. I want to have that adventure and try and use my time to do some good. If I can make one person’s journey better through life, then that’s an all-right goal to accomplish. I’ll keep trying to do that.

That’s wonderful.

Thank you.

I guess that brings this episode to a close. Until next time, where can we find you?

You can find me on Facebook at You can find me on Instagram, Twitter, and the Peloton leaderboard @ClipOutCrystal.

You can find me on Twitter @RogerQBert or on Facebook at You can find the show online on While you’re there, like the page and join the group. Don’t forget, you can watch this on YouTube. Hopefully, they cut all the parts where you were crabby with me.

Let’s hope.

The show is three minutes this week.

It wasn’t that bad.

Anyway, that’s it for this one. Thanks for tuning in. Until next time, keep pedaling and running and rowing.


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