336. Peloton Addresses Lululemon Size-Inclusivity Complaints Plus Our Interview With David Kipper (Pt. 2)

Last Updated: November 21, 2023By Crystal OKeefe (#ClipOutCrystal)Tags: Addiction Recovery, Behavioral Change, Brain Chemistry, Lifestyle Changes, Neurochemistry, Peloton

TCO Writer Kelli does a deep dive into Peloton’s partnership with Lululemon’s Mirror.
Peloton addresses Lululemon size-inclusivity concerns.
Peloton Entertainment officially launches.
UFC President blasts Peloton for pulling ads.
Peloton Canada gets a new General Manager.
Peloton announces a new capsule collection and a new “Brands We Love.”
Rebecca Kennedy began a career as a voice actor.
Adrian Williams partners with the Brain Aneurysm Awareness Foundation.
Matt Wilpers talks to Swagger Magazine about Row’s Canadian release.
Angelo has tips for holiday sweets.
The latest artist series features Blink 182.
Peloton releases its Disney Collection.
TCO Top Five.
The History of Turkey Burn.
Callie Gullickson debuts Soundtrack Strength Club.
Emma Lovewell and Matt Wilpers teamed up.
Are live stretches starting next week?
Birthdays – Bradley Rose (11/22)

All this plus part 2 of our interview with David Kipper.

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Watch the episode here

Listen to the podcast here

Peloton Addresses Lululemon Size-Inclusivity Complaints Plus Our Interview With David Kipper (Pt. 2)

We have had an insane week. It’s not Peloton-related at all. Some of you know about our son’s college journey, and the wheels have come off through no fault of Brian’s whatsoever. He’s been doing great. Unfortunately the college, not so much.

They made some major mistakes.

This might be more of a Patreon conversation. It’s gotten weird and ugly.

If there are any Connecticut lawyers out there, we’d love to have a quick chat. It got ugly.

If we sound less than focused, that’s why.

Although today is better than yesterday. Maybe not, since I can’t talk.

It’s not your fault.

It’s going to be one of those.

I guess we should start by saying that we did the book club. Thank you to everyone who showed up. It was even more people than last time, so it’s great to see growth. The author joined us. The author joined us last time too, but we already had a preexisting relationship with David Miller. Not to take him for granted but we’ve already known him and have interacted with him, so we weren’t shocked when he agreed to participate.

We were a little shocked when Sara did.

We were like, “Hey, total stranger, do you want to hear what random strangers think about your book?”

It turns out she did.

Luckily, they liked it. It was a great conversation.

We have so many behind-the-scenes stories. It was so great. For those of you who missed it and you’re like, “I meant to go last night, ” don’t worry. If you’re a Patreon member for free, you can just go over there. I put the entire recording up. It’s an hour and a half. It was a delightful conversation. We got so many inside stories and so many insights into the characters and what she was thinking, how long it took her to write the book, and what books are coming up next for her. It was a delightful conversation.

That’s just one of the many facets of Patreon Clipped Out stuff and that part is free. It doesn’t cost you a dime. We don’t need your credit card number. You’re going to be accidentally get billed.

We don’t do that.

Patreon might. I don’t know, but I don’t think they do. We don’t control ultimately what Patreon does. Also, if you’re interested, just a reminder, we changed the structure for Patreon membership. Now, it’s $5. You get all the bonus content. You get ad-free episodes. If we get it early, you get it early. All the things that come with a Patreon membership are now just $5. If $10 sounded like a big commitment, $5 is almost half of that.

Our intention is to keep this episode shorter. We’re trying to reach more people who might be casual Peloton members while still providing content for those of us who love to know every single Peloton nugget.

What pray tell do you have in store for people?

While we’re on the book club thing. I just wanted to say we also chose two new books. We chose one for December. That is going to be Evvie Drake Starts Over and then for January, we are going to be reading Book Lovers, and then we have part two of our interview with David Kipper.

The interview was so long. We decided to break it up into two chunks. Since we’ve been talking about how these need to be shorter, we held ourselves accountable and we broke it into two.

On that note, we have a little bit of a deep dive into the Lululemon Mirror/Peloton partnership. We also are going to talk about Peloton addressing size inclusivity concerns. There are lots of other updates coming from Peloton. We have a few instructor updates, and then we also have the artist series and a bunch of content updates. Tom, do you want to tell them what is in the bonus episode that they might be interested in?

In the Patreon episode, we’re going to talk about how Peloton is facing apparel delays, and Matt Wilpers had a nice reveal about longer Power Zone rides. People are into that. It seems like a lot of them are.

We also have several classes that we are going to be doing reviews on. We’re going to talk about those and some other fun content that Peloton is putting out.

That’s all the extra stuff that you’ll find over there. Before we get to all of that, shameless plugs, don’t forget we’re available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google, iHeart, TuneIn. Wherever you find a podcast, you can find us. While you’re there, be sure and follow us so you never miss an episode. Maybe leave us a review. That’s super helpful for us and helpful for the people who come along after you.

You can also find us on Facebook at Facebook.com/TheClipOut. While you’re there, like the page and join the group. Don’t forget our YouTube channel at YouTube.com/TheClipOut. You can sign up for our mailing list at TheClipOut.com and of course, our aforementioned Patreon, Patreon.com/TheClipOut. For $5 a month, you get these episodes ad-free. If we get them early, you get them early. You get the bonus content and all the things for just $5 a month. If you love the show but you still want to commit to that, the easiest thing you can do to help out, if you would be so inclined, is to share an episode in your social media feed. That goes a long way toward letting other people know that we exist. There’s all that. Let’s dig in. Shall we?

We shall.

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Peloton and Lululemon have collaborated on apparel lines. A lot of people were very excited, but there were some people who were not so excited.

It’s not even that they weren’t excited about the collaboration.

They were excited about the collaboration but they felt left out.

They did feel left out. Just a little background, Lululemon has had its own issues with sizing. As part of those issues, and they’ve been called to the carpet for it, they have made a change in how they do things. This is before Peloton. They started making their sizes more inclusive. It used to stop at size 12. Now, it goes to size 20. A lot of people have told me and I’ve heard this from many people that Lululemon stuff is not typically found in stores above size 12. You typically have to buy it online. I’m not saying always, but typically.

As you also know, Peloton has been trying to add to their line of sizes. They’ve been doing that steadily over the last couple of years. I talked to Jenn Cotter the other day and she verified that for women, it’s up to 3XL or size 24. For men, it’s more like double XL. When the partnership with Lululemon and Peloton came together, people expected to see all the way up to size 20 on all the lines and it was not. Most of the items stopped at size 12. There were a couple that came in at size 14, but nothing above that.

For the first drop that occurred, that was a big deal. I think everybody thought, “Maybe the next one.” The next one dropped and it didn’t have it either. That led to me reaching out to Peloton and saying, “Can we get some insight as to what’s causing this?” I could guess all day, but real facts would be super helpful. Jenn Cotter was nice enough to sit down with me in an exclusive conversation. She explained to me that what came first was the Mirror and Peloton deal. That was the majority of the conversation.

That’s the crux of the partnership. That’s the meat and potatoes of it all.

Through that, they were like, “Let’s start selling these clothes again together.” That was like, “Yeah, we should do that.” Everybody thought that was a great idea because members had asked for another Lululemon collection. Peloton felt like that would be a great solution. However, I don’t know exactly how Lululemon allocates things but it is clear that they only make a certain amount of clothing in certain sizes, and those sizes were not available for Peloton to buy right away.

Since everybody wanted to get the collaboration going, they went ahead and did that, but they were not able to get the extended clothing sizes in the first couple. The good news is that, going forward, we’re going to see more and more. I heard that there is going to be another drop soon, and there will be size 18s and size 20s in there in several different styles. We will know that as soon as it drops, but that’s in the coming weeks. I don’t mean tomorrow but in the coming weeks. When that occurs, we’re going to see more. It’s not going to be all the way across the board though. To see every single style that Lululemon already makes, we’re going to have to wait till sometime next year for it to be every style.

It’s like a ramp-up. As they get more and more pieces in, they’re working them into the drop.

There are still a lot of people who feel like, “Then they shouldn’t have done the partnership.” I say this. I don’t even know how you made that decision. Everybody is on Peloton to make more money and do more things. This partnership with Lululemon and Peloton, with Peloton doing the actual content for Mirror, whatever the terms of that partnership during the earnings call, they said it was going to make $10 million in this second quarter of the fiscal year. How do you turn that down while we wait for some sizes to come in? That would be foolish. That would be leaving a lot of money on the table. Potentially, Lululemon could have gone somewhere else. I don’t think that would have been smart.

Especially when your short-term or medium-term plan, once the products are physically available, is to incorporate it. It was never intended to never do it. It was just that the stuff doesn’t exist yet and we’re ordering it, but you can’t just snap your fingers and have it.

Clothing takes a long time to order. To get the quantities that Peloton needed for the people who ordered, they’re going to have to wait a little bit on the extended sizes. I’m just reading between the lines. No one said this part to me, but it seems to me that Lululemon has not been making tons and tons of those extended sizes because, for whatever reason, they’re not selling them in the same quantities. I think that they did not have them readily available, but they will, which is cool.

That’s good. Now I need height inclusivity.

I know, right? There are so many things that people have. To that point, Tom, not only height but I think about what we talk to the Runway of Dreams folks about. There are so many things that clothing designers need to be inclusive of people who can’t tie their shoes, and people who don’t have an arm to undo buttons on their shirts. Maybe they don’t have the dexterity in their fingers to do it. There are so many things, and I get it. I truly get it that people are upset that they don’t have these things. To your point, Tom, there are a lot of things that all manufacturers could do well to go ahead and increase everything.

If you can’t get enough of Peloton-Lululemon stuff, over on TheClipOut.com, we have an article all about the Peloton/Lululemon Mirror rollout because that’s been going on for about two weeks now.

I think it officially dropped on the 2nd or something like that. One of our Helper Bees, Kelli, has a Mirror. She was like, “I want to look into this a little bit more and see how things change.” She went into a lot of detail. She started this article with what’s different or what’s changing, and then it snowballed from there, as things do. This is an in-depth article for people who want to read what changes have happened and what hasn’t changed.

From the Peloton side, the big thing that happened when they rolled this out was that a lot of classes available on the Peloton platform are now available on the Lululemon Mirror platform. That’s the big thing. I believe it’s in the spring, all content that is going to be used on the Mirror will be provided by Peloton. Right now, they just have access to classes but soon, everything that they do is all created by Peloton.

It’s going to be like a Guide+.

Yeah, it will. On the Mirror side, the big thing that seems to be different is there seems to be some confusion about some content that used to be there is no longer there. There are a lot of upset people over in the Mirror world. If you are a Mirror user, you can get the Peloton membership for free. It’s part of things now. That’s pretty cool because you get both worlds for one low membership. That’s what we always hoped would happen with Tonal.

If you have an all-access membership and you have a Mirror, is it baked in now?

Yeah, I think so. Not yet because it’s not all content. It’s not baked into the Mirror itself. You still have two separate platforms.

Okay, but you’re allowed to log in as a Peloton member.

That is my understanding, yes.

I would think the Mirror prices have come down and down. If the content is free to you since you already have a Peloton membership, all of a sudden, maybe the Mirror looks a little bit more attractive because you’re getting Peloton content.

I don’t know because you still have to pay a membership fee for one of the two.

I mean if you’re already paying for Peloton membership.

I don’t know. I don’t get it. To me, it’s like if you have it, now you get the benefit of Peloton, but I can’t see going out and buying one. I’m not trying to be mean, but I just don’t see why anybody would.

We’ve been talking for months now about Peloton Entertainment being in beta and it is now in alpha or gamma, whichever direction that goes.

I don’t know but it’s here. They kicked this off with the NBA League Pass. It went out for reels. To recap, you can get access to things like Netflix, Disney+, and now NBA League Pass. You still have to have memberships with those. You don’t just get it for free. One of the things that people kept getting annoyed at during beta, and it was beta so it’s understandable, is that when you log out, you would go back in and you’d have to put your credentials in again.

It wouldn’t remember you.

I have no idea if this is accurate or not, but somebody brought up that they thought that had to do with tokens. It has to have a way to cut it off, otherwise, people could use those devices all the time unfairly. That’s why they weren’t doing that. I have also heard that people said that it was working correctly now that it’s been officially rolled out.

Maybe that was part of what made a beta. They didn’t give them full access to utilize it like that to prevent them from being able to put something in beta and leave it in beta for extended periods of time.

Seriously though, that did keep me from using it. The other day, I was going to do my VO2 master test and I was in my monthly check-in. I went to hop on the tread and I was like, “This would be a great time to do entertainment,” because I can just have my metrics but I don’t have any timed class. It was like, “Login. I don’t freaking know.” I can’t remember anything. This brain thing is annoying. I have nothing left in there when it comes to memory. I was like, “I don’t know,” so I gave up and I just went to class.

I would absolutely not use it if I had to log in.

I’m not saying it will stay like that because maybe if I had logged in, it would have stayed logged in, but I just wanted to get it done and move on, so I gave up. Honestly, I am a little frustrated with the naysayers of this. I get there are people that’ll never use this and I totally understand why they won’t.

It doesn’t affect your life one bit.

They keep saying all these things like, “Peloton has lost their way. It’s no longer fully yada, yada, yada.” I don’t know that that’s actually true. I think that by the end of Foley’s era, he probably had capitulated quite a bit on that because he wanted to have a whole bunch of members. I get that a lot of you are where I used to be with Barry, where you don’t agree with things that he’s doing. I think that if you want to get a bunch of members, you have to meet them where they are, not where you think they should be.

It can come off as a little judgmental if you’re like, “That’s not how you workout.” I think there are a lot of people who love Peloton classes. Sometimes, they just want to get on their bike and pedal or they just want to get on their tread.

It’s like the other day. I didn’t want to “waste” a class because I love taking my running classes, but in this particular instance, since I was doing a graded test, I needed to change the incline at certain moments. I didn’t want to be distracted by a Peloton instructor telling me to go faster or do different things because I wanted to do what the instructor was telling me to do. At this point, I just wanted to be in my own zone. Why are we telling people that that’s wrong? I don’t understand. I don’t get it.

What we haven’t gotten to do in a long time on the show is talk about politics. Thanks to the UFC, we get to do that. I guess the president of UFC was taking a dump on Peloton because he said that they pulled their podcast ads over an interview he did with Robert F. Kennedy Jr. He was not happy about that so he ordered all the Peloton equipment out of the UFC gyms.

I saw some crabby stuff happening over on Twitter as a response to this, which I was surprised at.

Really, on Twitter, that surprises you?

It’s not because it was Twitter. I just don’t know why anyone cares about any of this. If you’re going to have so much hatred coming up in the next election, do we have to start already?

I use Twitter sometimes to try and look for guests. I’ll do a search on Peloton and just scroll through people talking about Peloton. It’s become practically worthless because right now, the only people left over there are super-conservatives complaining about Peloton or about how Peloton is broke. That’s almost everything that comes up. I’ve fallen out of the habit of doing it because it’s become completely worthless. It doesn’t surprise me at all.

I feel bad when somebody interacts with my Twitter or anything because I don’t look at it because of what you just said. It’s so ugly. Twitter in general is so ugly. I don’t even mean about politics or not. People are so hateful over there all the time.

Also, I thought he said in the interview that this happened during the IPO. They were like, “We’re getting ready to launch an IPO,” and they didn’t want to be attached to any controversy.

Why are we then talking about this three years later?

It seemed like an attention grab. This is my guess of what was driving it because this would be pre-COVID if it’s the IPO.

It means it’s the old regime too.

I think it was attached to the fact that Robert F. Kennedy was definitely an anti-vaxxer and they didn’t want any part of it. We are pro-vaccine.

We’re on the record as being.

We did a medical study. Part two of the David Kipper interview is going to talk about vaccines and their importance. If that’s a problem for you, bye.

That’s just science. There’s nothing to debate.

This is ultimately an old story.

That’s weird that this is just coming up.

That’s because he mentioned it.

I know, but I think that’s going to be the whole next term.

Moving right along, Canada has a new Peloton general manager.

He is Mike Williams, I believe. He has a bunch of industry experience and he is going to be helping Canada grow and get in the places where they need to be in front of people to help grow Canada, which is nice because we don’t hear a lot about Canada. Peloton Canada does their thing. A lot of the members up there feel like they get ignored and forgotten. Mike, come on. Help them out. Let’s hope that happens. That’d be great.

Also, a couple of quick hits in this segment, there is a new Brands We Love thing.

Peloton is now putting on its website partner brands. They’ve never done that before. Now they have this link to Hyperice and you can buy them on Peloton’s website, and this Malin+Goetz, which we talked about before. It is in all of their showers and things like that. It smells amazing. Now, you can get that on their website. The interesting thing is that Hyperice was more expensive on the Peloton website than other places and they were sold out. I will never understand Peloton’s buying trends from their customers. I do not get it.

It makes zero sense.

Speaking of, Peloton did this other holiday capsule with Varley. Beautiful coats. I’m pretty sure this is the one from Jenny of Jersey Shore. Remember how I was like, “I really like that coat,” and then I looked it up and I was like, “Oh.” It’s this. I’m 99% sure.

We don’t have enough Patreon members for that.

No, but this coat is beautiful. It’s $500. If you buy it in Canada, it’s $660.

It’s colder in Canada so it has to work harder.

The crazy thing is they were sold out in a day.

You can’t argue with their success unless there are only two of them.

I don’t think so.

What size did they go to? Tell me that.

What’s the height restriction?

Coming up after this, we are going to talk about instructors in the news. We’re going to tell you which one is embarking on a career as a voice actor. Stick around.

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Rebecca Kennedy has announced that she is going to be a voice-over actor.

Apparently, she’s been working on this for over a year and she decided to go for it. Put it out there. I think that’s cool. I know I’ve said this before but I’m going to say it again. I’m so jealous of these Peloton instructors. They have so many things open to them that the average person doesn’t just because of their job, and it’s not just Peloton instructors.

It happens in a lot of different industries.

Totally, but because we read this stuff all day, I’m jealous but I’m also very happy for her. She’s super sweet. I think she’d be amazing at it. I think that’s cool and fun.

Adrian Williams was on television, WHDH Channel 7 in Boston to promote Brain Aneurysm Awareness.

He has the the Brain Aneurysm Awareness Foundation. He has partnered with them and he is raising money for them. He was on the news talking about why it’s important and all the things you can do. I love Adrian and I love everything that’s happening here, but the name of their little campaign cracked me up. “Stop the pop.” That’s dark.

That sounds like something might come up.

I was like, “They went with that? That’s what they landed on?” I was surprised. In this news, as you can see, they’re talking about being able to recognize the symptoms of aneurysm.

One of them is a pop, but I have a feeling at that point, it might be too late.

I worked with a guy. I remember his name is Jim, and I worked with him for years. One day, his wife had an aneurysm. She had symptoms like a splitting headache you’ve never experienced, like the worst headache in your life. It wouldn’t stop after a few minutes and it came on so suddenly that he was like, “You need to go to the doctor,” and he took her straight to the hospital. She lived but it was dicey.

Most people don’t. That’s why something like this is so important and near and dear to his heart because he lost his grandmother to this.

In 2018. That is correct. It’s amazing that he’s doing this and he’s speaking out about it. The counterpoint to my saying, “I’m so jealous of Rebecca Kennedy starting off with this new career,” is that all of these instructors do things like this, which is amazing. Adrian is out there using that platform that he has to raise awareness. That’s cool.

Matt Wilpers was featured on SwaggerMagazine.com, which is owned and operated by Robin Arzon. They trademarked that word. Right?

Honestly, Tom, when I saw this, I really thought that it was. I was like, “Did she start a magazine?” It’s not outside the realm of possibility.

This website is not affiliated with Robin Arzon to the best of our knowledge. Matt Wilpers was featured on there talking about Peloton Row and its launch in Canada. We were talking earlier about how Canadian members feel like they don’t get attention. Here’s Matt Wilpers for you.

It’s Matt Wilpers. It’s not Canada. That’s a great feature and it was great that he talked about why rowing is so helpful to your body and all the benefits you can get from rowing. That is cool. We think we’re going to see this in the UK soon. Canada, enjoy your moment because your time is about up.

Maybe for Canada, they came up with the Peloton sled.

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Joining us from MetPro is Angelo, here to answer all of your fitness and nutrition questions. Hello, Angelo.

Thanks for having me back.

We are appreciative you’re here. It is the time of year for a lot of parties and things like that. One of the questions that I saw come in is from Peggy Pearson. She talks about how to avoid the sugar craze, cookies, cakes, and pies that come in at holiday time. She loves sweets and definitely falls off the wagon in December. Do you have any thoughts about that?

I do, Peggy. This is probably one of the most common questions we get especially at the end of the year when there are a lot of social events and a lot of junk food around. I have a story and I have a strategy. Let’s start with an acknowledgment. The goodies, cookies, cakes, and candies taste good. You are always going to crave them because they taste good. The determining factor in our success at establishing the willpower to stay on our course and indulge when we want to, not when we don’t want to, there’s a difference there, really comes down to how solid the rest of your nutritional routine is.

When you have food that you naturally crave and it tastes good here is usually the deciding factor. If you’re confronted with it while you’re hungry, it’s going to be a losing equation, or while you have low blood sugar. If you have gone out of your way, just like we do with any of our clients, the first thing we do is establish a scheduled routine for eating. We’re going to have a scheduled breakfast. We’re going to have scheduled lunch and snacks. There can be variety within that, but at least some sort of cadence of regular fueling. That’s to eliminate the cravings associated with uneven blood sugar.

Peggy, if you can get into a good routine of having a balanced complete meal, breakfast, lunch, and a couple of simple snacks, you’re going to find that when those sugary treats are around, you’ll have much better odds of being able to resist the temptation if you’re not going into it hungry.

Here’s the story I’d like to tell. I had a client who around this time of year got into – it wasn’t wasn’t this time of year. It was a different time of year when they put out the Pepto-Bismol-flavored hearts. The grossest candy, no demand. She said to me, “Angelo, they had the candy dish and they had those hearts out. I got into that. I blew it this week. I was eating them all week.” Now listen to me, if you’re going to indulge in something, I support that but indulge in something you like. Don’t indulge in it’s Tuesday. The candy dish is out. It’s not that special. Let it be something special.

If you have an occasion, if you have a social event, or if you have family over and you want to have a special dessert a treat, enjoy yourself. One meal is never a problem. It’s the little small indiscretions in between that add up to a big problem. I would encourage you not to think of it in terms of I can never indulge. Think of it in terms of “Monday through Friday, I have my routine. During the work week, I have my routine.” Don’t allow yourself to fall into the trap of sugar-snacking on things that aren’t really that exciting in the first place. Of course, that’s going to dovetail back into your food prep and routine, and having solid foods because it is amazing how less appealing those middle-of-the-road sweets are when you’re not hungry because you filled up on quality foods first.

Peggy, those are the big-picture recommendations that I have. For each of our clients at MetPro, we dive into more of the nitty-gritty. For some people, we come up with low-sugar snacks, things that can appease the sweet tooth. There are a lot of fruit things and tricks that you can do. For some people, we try and keep them away from anything sweet because we don’t want to trigger those cravings. Sometimes we play around with the timing of protein and even the timing or frequency of meals, but the grandfather strategy that I would recommend is eat first, eat healthy, and then you’re going to have willpower when the candy dish is out. You can still indulge but pick and choose when you do so.

Here’s what I think people should do. You were talking about gross candy. They have candy that’s gross like prank candy or jelly beans. Let’s say you like the jelly beans. You get yourself a big bowl of jelly beans, and then you get 10 or 15 of the ones that taste like rat puke. You sprinkle them in there and you stir it up real good. You’re only going to go to that bowl when you really want a jelly bean because there’s a chance you’re going to get one that tastes like rat puke. You’re not just going to sit there and graze all day because it’s like Russian Roulette. You’re only going to do it when you really want a jelly bean.

Deep thoughts with Tom.

You are welcome. If some people don’t think my advice is good and they would like your advice tailored to their own specific situation, where can they find you and your acolytes?

Thank you.

Coming up after this, we’re going to talk about the latest artist series and give you the TCO Top Five. Stick around.

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The latest artist series features none other than Blink 182.

I am so stoked about this one.

Before you get on the bike, take off your pants and jacket.

I can’t wait for this one. You’re going to be in a bunch of different classes, all different kinds of classes. We get a Lanebreak ride and a Lanebreak run. By the way, there is going to be a 10-minute Shadow Boxing class. Travis Barker is going to be there playing drums live during the class.

How about that?

It’s the first time ever that we have had a drummer play live during a class.

I bet this would be a good Lanebreak.

Yeah. I can’t wait.

Also, we have the Disney Collection coming out.

There’s been a lot of Disney classes that have occurred over the last couple of years. Now, there is an official collection for them, 70 classes. You have everything in this, including Family Fun Fit classes. This will be a good one especially if you have the family over for the holiday and you need to do something with little kids who have way too much energy. This could be fun to put on for them. Also, this graphic is adorable.

It has Disney stuff.

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It is time for the TCO Top Five. Every week, we crowd-source from you, our loyal listeners, to figure out which classes you like the best, and then we spit them back at you for the people who are flummoxed about what to take next.

People have been getting excited about this. In fact, I saw somebody say, “I’ve been waiting for this post.” That made me so happy. First up, we got our favorite Peloton body-weight, body-strength. This comes from Andy Speer, 10/31/20. We’re taking it back to 2020, 10 minutes. Alexandra said, “I may have already shouted out Andy’s 10-minute body-weight class from 10/31/20. I’ve taken it so many times and just put it on again because I have some long-term goals for aging, like balance, which is what this class focuses on. I love it.” I love that you put that in there. Thank you.

We have the favorite Peloton run. This is the 30-minute East London scenic run with Jermaine Johnson. Cindy Stewart said that this is her favorite class. She doesn’t do these often, scenic classes, but she’s been to London twice this year and she’s going back at the end of the month. Maybe we’ll see you, Cindy. “I love the tour of East London and hearing JJ’s long history of living in the area.” I like it.

Next, we have our favorite Peloton total body strength. Teresa Ross said, “My favorite workout was RK’s 45-minute full body strength workout from 7/21/23. It was a descending pyramid of reps of various exercises starting at a hundred reps total, and a warm-up, 10 different movements, finishing with 10 reps, and a bonus burner. I bookmarked it to take monthly. It’s so much fun.” Teresa, I think you like punishment.

It’s interesting that you say that because the article goes on to say that they reached out to Teresa to ask whether this should be unstackable.

She said no. She said she did it after a 45-minute run and then finished it up with 10 minutes of core and a 10-minute stretch. It was a long workout day. It was empowering. Teresa is a badass.

Either it’s not unstackable or she’s just humble bragging. It’s like going to the pharmacy and being like, “Is Magnum the biggest? I guess I’ll make it do. Let’s hope it doesn’t cut off circulation.”

Boys always go back to that. We then have the favorite Peloton upper body strength. It’s all about strength this week. This one came from Logan on August 8th, 2023. Pat darling, who is a darling.

She was in our book club.

It was her idea to pull two books instead of just one because of the busy holiday season.

She’s very helpful. Maybe she’s secretly a book publisher, trying to sell more books. We’re on to you, Pat Darling.

We talked to her in LA when we went to the meet-up there in San Jose. She was telling us what she did and it’s super complex and it had nothing to do with books. I listened to Pat. Don’t worry.

No one expects me to remember anything. It’s nice.

Pat said that she loved Logan’s 20-minute upper body strength class on Tuesday, 8/8. She was in no mood to do strength. She’s so glad she chose this class because the playlist got her into it between Logan’s energy and the rock and hip-hop playlist. She got energized. Smart. I love it. For our unstackable, this is a good one. This one is from Tabatha Perault. Tabby’s Pickles if you’re wondering. I love that leaderboard name. She said, “You have to do Benny Adami’s Tabata class from May.”

Tabatha said, “Do you love tabata? Me neither, but this class was so much fun. I’d been sleeping on Benny Adami’s Sleeping On. It was Benny’s birthday and you’re celebrating with him by doing 50, yes, I said 50 tabatas. You will sing three words max. Every song in this diva-filled playlist because you won’t have enough breath for the entire run. In the words of Benny, ‘You will survive this. It will just be super painful.'”

Do you think the Disney Collection has Hakuna Tabatas?

If they don’t, they should.

Trademarked, The Clip Out. We own it now, any ideas. The Turkey Burn is almost upon us and Helper Bee Jenn did a retrospective or a walk down memory lane at Turkey Burns of the past.

She covered the charity. She covered when they started. She covered that Robin has done one every year. She hit the highlights of the pandemic. There’s a lot of great history in here. For those of you, especially those of you who are new to the community, this is exactly the kind of thing that you’re going to want to read because you’re going to want to know how special and why is it so special, the Turkey Burn. We then come to this year. If you scroll down there is a whole list of all of the classes that are going to be out this year. Tons of live classes. On Thursday, Tom, is going to be the first Thursday since I’ve owned a Peloton on Thanksgiving that we’re home.

Really? How about that? I remember sleeping during one of those Turkey Burns.

You did. I have participated but always like on an iPad. I’ve never been able to participate at home on my own equipment.

How exciting.

For me, it is. Anyway, it also hits off at 8:00 AM, Eastern. There’s going to be a 20-minute row with Matt Wilpers. Alex Toussaint hops on and does a run at 9:00 AM. Robin picks up and does a signature 45-minute ride at 10:00 AM, Eastern. Denis wraps up the morning with a 30-minute yoga flow at 11:00 AM. Basically, I will just be doing this all day.

I also saw an article the other day in the Washington Post that says if you exercise, it reduces hunger. If you’re worried about overeating on Thanksgiving, this can help you organically not be as hungry so you don’t feel like you’re making as much of a sacrifice if you’re concerned about that sort of stuff.

That’s a great point. I also want to point out that even though I talked about the live classes, there are also meditations that are going to be dropping that day or the day before, and then there are also stretch classes on the morning of November 3rd. It looks like those are going to be live stretches, which that’s new. There’s also going to be a Two For One outdoor Turkey Trot with Matty Maggiacomo and Olivia Amato. This is the Two For One you’ve been waiting for. Those two are freaking hilarious, and then a 30-minute Family Fit class with Jess Sims and a special guest.

It’s a turkey.

I thought it might just be the drummer guy.

Maybe it’s Santa. It’ll be like the Macy’s Parade and the Turkey Burn with an appearance from Santa. That’s how you know you’ve kicked off the holiday season.

I would be down for that.

Callie Gullickson has debuted the Soundtrack Strength Club.

Long story short, each class is all around one movie soundtrack. The very first one was The Princess Diaries and she’s going to change it up every single week. I love this idea.

She needs to do the soundtrack to the Monkees film Head.

Sure. I bet that’s on her list.

I have no doubt. I can only imagine the wonderful workout you can get from the Porpoise Song.

I think her first season is only six episodes. It may not have made it into the first season.

It’s probably the season premiere for season two. That’s my guess. If they did that, people would be like, “Come on. You have to use it to do a Peloton workout.” If they did a whole class to the soundtrack of Head, I would cave.

I’m emailing Peloton right now.

That’s why I’m saying it. Finally, for this segment, Emma and Matt got a collab going. Wonder Twin Powers Activate.

Peloton has never done this before. They curated and cross-programmed each other’s classes. Matt made up the the list like, “Here’s all the changes you should make in your class,” and the plan was by Matt and then he’s doing a Power Zone ride, and she’s curating the playlist.

It’s how mean are they going to be to each other.

I don’t know. People pick on Matt for his music choices. I think people are like, “Emma, you do one.” It’s going to be great.

I hope she picks really bad music.

That would be hilarious.

I hope the whole class is just Matthew Wilder’s Break My Stride over and over again. That’s what I hope. That would be good.

—

We only have one birthday. It’s from Bradley Rose who celebrates his birthday on November 22nd.

Happy birthday, Bradley Rose.

Happy birthday. Coming up after this, we’re going to give you part two of our interview with David Kipper. We’re going to continue our brain talk, and also talk about vaccines and whatnot because we know people love whatnot. Stick around.

—

When you talk about making specific plans for people, I’m curious how to fit in the exercise based on your examples of using Peloton. That makes sense to me in how you would motivate people. When it comes to eating better, I’m curious how you put together plans for people because again, I think of somebody like myself where it’s like I want the chocolate. If it’s in the house, I’m going to eat it. How do you motivate people to eat better when they are those people who’ll just jump on it?

You look at what drives people to eat and drives people to all these behaviors. You have a shield that’s serotonin deficient. They tend to eat to soothe bad feelings. They soothe their anxiety by eating. The dopamine person eats to stimulate. They eat in order to get alert, to get awake, to get some sugar intake. If you’re eating to soothe bad feelings, then you can soothe bad feelings in a different way.

Perhaps getting on a Peloton and creating endorphins that are going to ally that anxiety in a different way. This is how you do this. We talked about durability. For durability, you have to create long-term programs. It isn’t just giving them three things to do. You build it up so that you can keep them interested, especially on the dopamine side. They’re going to get bored.

You have to build the reward system gradually over time. In the beginning, they get little rewards and then they get bigger and bigger. For the eating behavior of a dopamine person, they’re going to eat to stimulate. Where this becomes problematic is that they can gain weight just as the shield can gain weight. For these people, you have to replace that behavior to stimulate them. Instead of going for a pizza, why don’t you get on the Peloton and stimulate yourself that way?

Get into one of those programs where you’re around a bunch of people and mix it up so that you don’t get bored again. They go to your house and can go on three different machines, so they have that variety. That’s how that works. You take those predictable behaviors and you build in some alternatives for them. You build in some rewards. If it’s a serotonin or a shield person, you reduce their anxiety and fear or you capitalize on that. Obviously, a few keep eating and your hemoglobin A1C diabetes test is elevated. You’re going down, buddy. You parlay into those behaviors and you create those plans around that.

New slogan. You’re going to die if you don’t buy a Peloton.

We’ll have to run that by marketing and see what they think, Tom.

We were both fairly evenly split on these.

Is there any takeaway that somebody who’s evenly split can do?

Is it wrong that I’m disappointed? I was hoping that I’d have been lopsided and there’d be a solution for me.

It actually indicates that your relationship is probably pretty solid and that you complement each other. If you’re even on the dopamine serotonin behaviors, then you look at the specific behavior. If you have a specific sword behavior, let’s say it’s impulse control, then you work on that and you work on that by mitigating that. Instead of ratcheting up from 1 to 10 in 2 seconds, your behaviors become, now you’ve got a count to 6 or you have to deep breathe or the minute you feel that impulse, you have to do something to slow yourself down. If you’re on the other side and you are holding things in until you explode.

He’s suddenly like, “I’m not so sure about the stability anymore. I would like to redact that statement.”

I think you should throw those test scores away. I’m going to rewrite this book. On the other side, you give specific behaviors that someone with that imbalance and that behavior will respond to. That’s how that works. You’re more complicated in the sense that you’re not just predictably a sword or predictably a shield. You have these mixed behavioral reactions.

We could even see that within the questions themselves. You’d ask a question and I’d be like, “In some situations, this would be true. In other situations, it would not be true at all.”

That’s a serotonin answer because you give the two questions to someone who’s got a serotonin imbalance and they’re going to think that through, “This is sometimes, but not this.” If you give that to a dopamine imbalance person, they’re going to answer that right away because they want to get onto the next question.

They’re already five questions down the road.

They answer that from their gut. The serotonin person is stuck in their head.

I was laughing at myself because I was trying to color in the brain and I didn’t read the directions thoroughly. I was like, “I think I proved the point.” I jumped right to the coloring.

She had her crayons all out and she’s ready to go. I was curious, speaking of the coloring, there are numbers that you color in if you answer a certain question in certain ways. Is there any correlation between where the numbers land in the brain?

No, but if you look at the images, one brain has 15 little circles with numbers on it. The other brain has the same. There are 15 serotonin questions and 15 dopamine questions. If you were taking your time and reading the instructions, you would look at the images and whichever image had more colored spots, that’s where you tend to lay. No, Tom, is the common answer to your question. The pattern was not created for any special reason other than a visual gestalt.

For the record, I did know I was supposed to count them. I didn’t understand where the trues and the falses were supposed to go.

It’s also because she’s a paper saver, she did it two-sided. We were trying to say, “I answered this, I did this, I got a color.” We were flipping them back and forth. That didn’t help.

I’ll do it differently next time.

I have a question for the two of you. Is there a profile for the person that buys a Peloton? There must be some marketing data that says this is the kind of person who is likely to buy an exercise machine.

Of course, again, we’re not affiliated with Peloton, but I follow their financials and marketing team very closely. I listen to all their earnings calls and things like that. Fascinatingly enough, it has evolved over time. When Peloton first arrived on the scene in 2013 and 2014, the average person to buy was over the age of 40 and had a very high income. They were at least $100,000 above that. They tend to be a person who loves technology and loves new things. They were excited about new stuff. Early adopters.

To piggyback off that real quick, it would show up in our downloads because almost all of our downloads were on Apple Podcasts because those were the first people to run out and adopt a smartphone technology. It was like 95% of our downloads were Apple Podcasts. Over the years, that has leveled out as Peloton has gotten more mainstream.

Peloton has been making a big effort to democratize fitness. They want to have Peloton in the hands of more people. Now, their focus has evolved where it’s more of a subscription model and they’re pushing the subscription to the app no matter what kind of machine you have. That is a very different place than they started from.

Because of that, it has now started to get younger and younger, the people who are into Peloton. It has also started to be a more diverse income and more ethnically diverse. It used to be a lot of middle-aged White people, that’s where they started. Now, they have definitely evolved. That’s something they are purposely striving toward. They want to be more diverse.

There’s an economic barrier to getting into the Peloton to start with. Have those prices come down over the years?

Here’s an interesting anecdote from the early days of Peloton. They originally discovered that when they upped the price of the bike, they sold more of them. Originally, the product was more aspirational. When they had the price point too low, people were skeptical of it and weren’t sure if it was worth it. When they raised the price, they actually ended up selling more of them. Once the brand was established, that wasn’t as much of a psychological deciding factor. The prices of the equipment have come down except for Tread+. They brought that price down and now they push the app. There are a lot of different entry points from a financial state.

You can rent the bike. You can lease the bike. They’re going to add other equipment to that eventually, too so that you can rent and lease.

They’ve refurbished bikes. There are lots of bikes in the secondary. There are a lot of different ways to acquire equipment now that there weren’t originally. From a more psychological profile standpoint, I’ve always found this interesting. We also have another show all about Tonal, which is like Peloton, but for strength training.

We have never had a problem getting guests for The Clip Out. Even when we were brand new and hadn’t even recorded an episode, we would ask people and they’d say, “Sure, sounds fun. I’m in.” For Tonal, it is like pulling teeth to get people to agree to be on the show. Even though we put out 50, 60 episodes and we’ve got this other show that’s like it, but about Peloton that they can look at, they’re like, “I don’t know.”

“I don’t know. I’ll think about it.” It’s like a different personality, which goes to strength training. You’re not getting those endorphins. I swear it has something to do with that. It’s fascinating. To your point about people who focus on strength training and are not as into cardio, I also don’t think they like talking in front of people. They’re not into that, whereas Peloton people might be a little flashier.

Did you see any big changes in the pandemic? The reason I’m asking is that what I saw is that people were exercising far less. I was very busy during the pandemic. We had no information and there was misinformation and everybody was scared and everyone was afraid of everyone else. It was a terrible time. I found that people, in order to align that angst, weren’t exercising. They weren’t doing things that could have actually mitigated that. Did you find anything during the pandemic as far as how many people went for these machines and how active that was?

I think our data set is skewed.

It is very skewed because we see so much Peloton activity. Peloton could be delivered to your home and you could ride at home and still get a good workout. Peloton was on the rise before the pandemic. It was popular, people loved it, but it was still very much like a niche. Tom always compares it to concerts because he books concerts for a living. He always compares it to they’re still at a club play.

I would say a theater play.

They were okay. They had moved to a theater. When the pandemic hit, overnight, they were in a stadium.

They went from arenas to stadiums almost instantly.

It was crazy. Everybody had a Peloton. It was insane.

They couldn’t keep them in stock. It took months to get one. That’s why I think our viewpoint is slightly skewed because we were immersed in the world of Peloton, where people were clamoring for them. You could sell a Peloton on the secondary market at that point for more than you paid for it. People were desperate to get one.

I actually sold mine to a nurse. She couldn’t go workout because she was a nurse and she couldn’t go to any gyms because she had to be careful. I had bought a Bike+ in the middle of the pandemic. I sold my bike and I didn’t sell it for much more than I bought it for. At that point, it was like a 4 to 5-year-old bike. She bought it for what I paid for it. I lost zero money on that deal and she was happy to pay it and happy to come get it. It was a crazy time. I hope we never repeat that.

Me too.

I can’t even imagine what you went through. It was terrifying.

It was terrifying for the doctors because we were as deficient in information as everyone else.

How weird must that have felt when you’re so used to being the person who has all the answers?

Where it got weird was when I got it. I got COVID. Knowing what I didn’t know was weird because if I were to get something, I’d pretty much have a sense of where that was going and how to deal with it. Getting something where people were dying and people were in hospitals and on respirators brought out the four-year-old in me. It’s interesting.

I guess you got it fairly early in.

I got it pretty early in. I didn’t go as far as drinking bleach, but I certainly didn’t have a problem with trying any of these other things that were being thrown out there.

Early on, we didn’t have answers. I’m much more blase about it now than I was in 2020. We took it very seriously, which, living in Missouri, we were the two, but now we’ve got vaccines and they have treatments and there are things out there to help you that weren’t there at the beginning. I don’t want to say flippant, but I’m not as concerned as I was at the beginning because I know that we’ve gotten our vaccines and we’ve gotten our boosters and there are things out there for us if they were to occur. We’re also fortunate that we don’t have any comorbidities or mitigating factors, so we don’t have to worry about that aspect of it either.

Now, when these variants come out, by the way, two new variants are now coming your way. The vaccine that’s coming out for COVID, get the vaccine because it’s specific for these variants. It doesn’t fall the way back to the first ones that were out. If you’re vaccinated, not to put in a plug for vaccines, you do much better and have a far less likelihood of getting long COVID. Here we are, a few years later, we’re starting to figure out some of these things.

There were four people in the house at the time. Two of us have gotten COVID, but the other two have not. We’ve managed to not have everyone in the house thus far get infected, which is surprising. We are definitely big believers in vaccines. We were actually some of the first people in the country to get vaccinated. We participated in the Moderna medical trial. I probably got my vaccine before you did. August 3rd, 2020 is when I got my vaccine. I didn’t know I got it until December because it was a double-blind.

They took the blinders off and we could find out.

It is changing. It’s not nearly as lethal as these variants develop. They’re better able to get into the cells but they are less dangerous. The contagious part of it goes up, but the danger of it goes down.

Isn’t that true of how those things normally work? Typically, the more contagious, the less dangerous the virus.

Yes. Now, add to the coming season the RSV virus that you’re hearing about, and there’s a vaccine for that, which you should consider getting and you can get all these lovely vaccines at the same time. Your arms are going to hurt for a couple of days, but you’re going to be protected. It’s interesting. The whole vaccine question became a mess because the country was divided as it was on many things and remains that way.

I was going to say I feel like they still are and it’s concerning. We live in a very red state and because of that, it’s a lot very conservative. The conservative views are very anti-vaccine. I’m not saying every conservative feels that way. I’m saying that tends to be how the lines are drawn.

It is odd because it used to be the other way.

It’s fascinating because my family is super conservative. I grew up in a very conservative home. I thought it was fascinating because, as conservative as my family is, they were the first ones to line up and get a vaccine as soon as they could. I found that fascinating because we can’t talk about anything politically at all because it gets very charged very quickly, but that we agreed on. I was grateful because that’s probably a good reason they’re still alive. It’s crazy.

I don’t know if we should direct this back to Peloton questions.

We probably should.

Before we started talking, you told us that you love to bounce around in the world of Peloton. You don’t have a preferred instructor. I guess you would have a very cogent answer for our next typical question. Do you have any advice for people getting a Peloton, whether it’s a bike, a tread, or a rower?

Don’t be afraid of it. All the options out there are overwhelming. Spend a minute looking around and seeing what is interesting to you. The most important thing about exercise is doing something you enjoy. You can’t tell people to go exercise. If I told Tom to go walk or jog, he’s not going to do that. You have to do something that you enjoy doing. Given all this variety that you have with this machine, look around. That would be my advice. You’re going to find something in there that fits your needs.

The most important thing about exercise is doing something you enjoy. Click To Tweet

I definitely agree with that advice. That is good advice.

People tried to tell me for years.

Also, try new things. If you’re uncomfortable trying new things, put yourself out there a little bit. Step out of your comfort zone because you’re going to find something that you didn’t know you could enjoy. Someone like me who needs new things and that stimulation is perfect for me. I’m never going to run out of choices. There are people who don’t want to go out of their normal activity. For those people, roll the dice. You’re going to find something.

Step out of your comfort zone because you're going to find something that you didn't know you could enjoy. Click To Tweet

Form a new activity. When you talk about how the different serotonin and dopamine levels affect your interest in working out, have you ever seen someone with low levels in either way that you’ve given medication to and then they’ve taken up exercising that you feel like, I know it’s anecdotal, but that played a role?

Yes. In fact, for a long time, as an internist, my bag of tricks was more pharmaceutical than behavioral. This is especially true in treating addictive disorders. For the first few months after you get somebody stabilized off of an addictive behavior, you do have to rebalance their neurochemistry. You do have to restore some serotonin. You do have to restore some dopamine. They get comfortable because those cravings because they were trying to fill that need, are filled by the pharmaceuticals that you give them.

It’s a trial-and-error process with the medications. Everybody reacts differently. It’s not generic and it does take a certain skill and experience level to know how to do this. You then add in the behavioral. You can’t get people to accept behavioral change until they are rebalanced. You put somebody into a 30-day program for addiction and you take away the drugs and people come out clean for 30 days.

The minute natural neurochemical imbalances come back and they become uncomfortable again in whatever way, they seek comfort in the same way that got them into that 30-day program. The recidivism rate is over 90% in these programs because they’re not combining the pharmacologic and behavioral. Also, Tom, to that point, you get somebody rebalanced and you treat them with behavioral techniques, and then you can start withdrawing the medications.

People don’t want to be on medicine for a long time. These medicines have a terrible connotative imprint. A lot of those people that will then you’ll get them off the medicines, they’ll come back to you in a month and say, “I felt so much better on those medicines.” I make the analogy that the brain is an organ, and the pancreas is an organ. The brain makes neurotransmitters, the pancreas makes insulin. Each organ makes its own product.

When the pancreas is not making insulin, you have diabetes. Nobody has any connotative look at a diabetic. Nobody says, “You’re a diabetic.” Someone says you are anxious and annoying and stop the depression. There’s a whole connotation to treating people neurochemically. I get it. I understand that. When Prozac came out, you couldn’t sell that drug to people. It was impossible. If you did get someone to take it, they were not talking about it.

Now, it’s practically in the water supply like fluoride.

It’s like almost everybody’s on Prozac or Zoloft or something.

You’ll understand this now. When they talk about 40% resistance to these medicines, it’s probably 40% who are getting the serotonergic medicines, the Prozacs, the Zolofts. The other side of the equation is people who need dopaminergic, their different neurotransmitters. That’s where this becomes tricky. You have to know your audience. If someone comes in and they’re depressed, you don’t just give them Prozac or something that’s got serotonin. You have to know where their imbalance is to treat that. It’s more complicated, but it’s actually less complicated. You have to look at it from that perspective.

I’ve always thought it was interesting that the only medically accepted “cure” for addiction has been 12-step programs. It’s like there’s no other disease you would tackle that with. Especially since they essentially revolve around higher power so people wouldn’t say, “I have diabetes.” Have you thought about praying about it? I don’t mean to take away from 12-step programs. There are people it absolutely works for. It’s like anything, but it’s not going to work for everybody. You’d think there’d be more than one tool in that toolbox.

I went to UCLA for all of my training. We weren’t taught about addiction. This was 100 years ago. It wasn’t something that they knew anything about. I think it’s true everywhere and I don’t think it’s where I practice, but there’s a tremendous amount of addiction. This was a medical illness that I knew nothing about and I learned about it and I’m glad I did. It’s everywhere.

My guess is when you went to medical school, it probably wasn’t even perceived as a medical problem. It was a character flaw.

It was a character flaw. That goes back to 12-step and that goes back to behavioral therapies. I did not believe in 12-step when I started treating this because I saw it as a neurochemical issue. What I didn’t understand, which I grew to understand, was that there’s a neurochemical issue here, but people also need to make these behavioral changes. 12-step was wonderful. I now recommend 12-step all the time.

First of all, it gives people with addictive disorders a community that has very much in common. It’s like you put somebody in a grief counseling thing. These people all have gone through the same horrible thing and they have something in common. The same works in 12-step. I think it’s important. You can’t treat addiction just from a pharmacologic standpoint. You can’t treat it just from a behavioral standpoint. You need both.

You can't treat addiction from a pharmacologic standpoint. You can't treat it from a behavioral standpoint. You need both. Click To Tweet

You would never tell anyone in grief counseling, “I’m going to deprive you of an antidepressant. If you’re that upset for an extended period of time, you have to power through on the grief counseling.” You would use both of those items.

There’s an interesting thing that’s happened. I’m getting way off of Peloton, but a drug came out for postpartum depression. Postpartum depression typically lasts for a few months. During that few months, the mom can totally reject the child. The child has long-term developmental and cognitive issues. What we would give people for postpartum depression were things like Prozac.

Those drugs, the serotonin drugs, take two months to start working. By that time, the damage had been done in that relationship. This new medicine starts working in two days. It’s brilliant. This is where pharmacology can be your friend and where you should at least open your eyes and your brain to this might be okay. Of course, behaviorally, you have to fill in the blanks.

Now you’ve got to do your own part. You can’t expect the drugs to do all the heavy lifting. You have to bring something to the equation.

Much like exercise.

Good segue. The brains of the outfit.

I waited for it.

I was going to end with a joke. Not one of mine. It’s one of my favorite jokes when you’re talking about the brain as an organ and it produces chemicals and all that stuff like any other organ in the body. This is from one of my favorite comedians. I think this guy is like the best joke writer of the latter half of the 20th century, Emo Phillips. He says, “I used to think the brain was the most fascinating of all the human organs and then I thought, ‘Look what’s telling me that.’”

A guy goes to the doctor and says, “If you just got on a Peloton, if you just got on a treadmill, you would add twenty years to your life.” The guy looks at him and he says, “Yeah, but that would be twenty years of treadmill.”

That sounds like me. Dr. Kipper, thank you so much for taking time out of your busy day. I don’t want to keep you any longer because I’m afraid there’ll be an extra copay. Before we let you go, let everybody know where they can find you and your show and your books and all the things.

The thing I’m most proud of is our podcast, which we’ve done as a radio program for over twelve years and we helped a lot of people. It was free and people called in and our podcast is now an extension of that. It’s called Bedside Matters. It airs every Monday. I do it with a radio talk show guy, Peter Tilden, a very funny guy. It’s entertaining. We have a woman, Ann Vocino, who is also very funny and that’s what we did. It’s a conversation about specific issues. We don’t talk all the time about Peloton. We talk a lot about it, but we don’t talk about it all the time. I hope people will enjoy it. If you’re a shield and want to get into the weeds on the brain chemistry stuff, look up Override on Amazon.

Thank you so much for joining us. We greatly appreciate this has been an absolute delight.

Thank you so much.

Likewise. I’m happy to endorse something that I use myself, so I’m glad we’re talking about something that I think is very valuable and it’s a great road to exercise and longevity and all the value that exercise brings.

Thank you.

—

I guess that brings this episode to a close. Until next time, where can people find you?

People can find me on Facebook at Facebook.com/crystaldokeefe. They can find me on all the socials @ClipOutCrystal and the Peloton leaderboard.

You can find me on Twitter @RogerQBert or on Facebook at Facebook.com/tomokeefe. You can find the show online on Facebook.com/TheClipOut. While you’re there, like the page and join the group. Don’t forget our Patreon at Patreon.com/TheClipOut where for $5 a month, you get all sorts of bonus content and you get ad-free episodes and all the things. For some reason, on YouTube, Crystal is showing you a bunny. You know it’s Thanksgiving, not Easter, right?

It was here.

It’s been here for months.

I know, but I feel like playing with it.

Anyway, that’s it for this one. Thanks for tuning in. Until next time, keep pedaling and running and rowing.

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